[00:00:00] Hey, welcome back to another episode of super human radio. We have a great show planned for you today during the first segment. I'm going to be joined by my co-host. Dr. Jeff Golini and we're going to talk about why Healthcare and airfares have something in common and what we should do about that.

And then a little later in the show Jason 4G is going to be on the show talking about why 95% of what you read about Fitness is dead wrong and he's been writing for Men's Health men's fitness muscular development muscle & Fitness detail ESPN Fast Company C, but the guy goes on and on he's been doing this for a long time and he's frustrated with the nonsense out there.

So we'll talk about that a little bit later in the show. Before we do anything else. I have to thank all American pharmaceutical in the FX sports for their title [00:01:00] sponsorship of super human radio right now. You can get six of the top selling products absolutely free by going to super human radio dotnet and clicking the EFX Banner ad.

You'll pay five dollars and change for shipping but that's truly the shipping cost. It's not a self-liquidating scam because you'll get a box full of goodies that you want to order again and again, and that's because dr. Jeff believes that nobody should buy anything until they've tried it and he puts his money where his mouth is.

This is science for humans with dr. Jeff Golini. Dr. J. How you doing man? I'm doing good. How about you wonderful. So I. I want to start this segment off. Dr. Jay. I want to pose a question to you. Okay? Okay. Let's say you and I are sitting in a restaurant we happen to be separated by an aisle.

So we're technically sitting across from each other and I order a beautiful. T-bone steak. It's like a $65 steak. And I order a bottle of champagne. It's like a hundred dollar bottle of champagne [00:02:00] and you look over at me and you go man. This guy's crazy. Obviously spending all that money for lunch.

And then the waitress asked you if you order you say I'm going to have a tuna fish sandwich and I'll just have a glass of water because I'm Frugal. I like to take care of my stuff at the end. We both finish our meal around the same time. The waitress comes down the aisle. And she gets between both of us and she addresses both of us that she says we have a policy here.

We're going to combine your both bills hundred sixty-five from mine and eight dollars for yours and then we're going to split it in half and you're going to pay half and I'm going to pay half. So I'm getting a really good deal. I was supposed to be $165, but I'm actually only going to pay half of a hundred sixty-five because you're going to carry the other half on your bill.

How would that make you feel? Well, I'll tell you what, I would be angry [00:03:00] and frustrated because you made good decisions about your lunch, but I just thought I went overboard right exactly. I would still stiff that would fill that, you know, this isn't fair. I mean, you know, why should I have to pay for something you ordered right?

And so there is nothing in life. That actually is totaled up that way or tallied that way other than airfare and Healthcare think about it. You have a flat rate on your airfare. Let's say a hundred ninety nine dollars each way and you weigh 200 pounds and somebody else who weighs 330 pounds pays the same fee.

But they're actually costing more because fuel is being used to a greater degree to carry their weight than yours. But you have to pay you have to subsidize their airfare. Yeah, and that is interesting because you know, the airplanes all go by weight. I mean they calculate I wonder what they use for an average of a person's weight because they don't weigh people on the way in.

Well, they've got to be using the national [00:04:00] average. So let me tell you something that I happen to know from the inside. H? It costs an airline. You ready for this $24,000 a year to carry a case of for six packs of soda or water back and forth back and forth on an annual Flight Plan. Yeah twenty four thousand a year.

So they even know what it costs to carry the soda. They clearly all of their profits are based on what it costs to get you there and gas. And that's how they make their profits. So why are they charging you and me more than the same prices? They charge somebody who's 340 pounds, you know, and that is a good question because as you know, it seems like the airlines are giving you less and less room all the time.

And there's nothing worse than to get on a flight and be crunched between two overweight people and I can't tell you how many times that's happened to me and it's ridiculous because first of all those people think I paid for my chair, you know, [00:05:00] I have Ivory right yet. They're flopping over in yours, right?

I had one flight extremely overweight woman and I try to be courteous, you know. But you know what when I got both my elbows inside my area and I'm looking down I got no room for my feet. Her feet are all flapped in front of mine. I finally had to say something, you know, it was like look, would you mind scooting over a little bit?

Well, I can be wherever I want I said no there is a line from my chair. Down move over and I had to get a little rude because it's like I got no room, right you had no place to go but you know some Airlines I have heard have charge people for two chairs. Yes, if you're if you actually are that big and let's talk about that.

Imagine how big you have to be for an airline to say we got to charge you for two seats. Now see when you buying an airline on the phone or online, they're not asking [00:06:00] you what your weight is. They don't figure that out until you get there and they go you know what you can't fit in the single-seat you have to buy two and those people using raise.

Holy hell. Oh, you know your fat shaming and all this other stuff. No, it's a business decision, but. What about the person who can literally squeeze into that seat but they're literally bleeding into both seats next to them. Assuming they're in the middle, right? Yeah, they so you have to lean one way.

The other person has to lean the other way to give them room. But just look at the logistics. Can we both agree that you I don't I'm not I don't care if it's insulin. I don't care if it's carbs. I don't care if it's this. What can we both agree that in order to become fat? You have to be eating the food, right?

Yeah, exactly. I mean there's no fat people in prisoner-of-war camps, right? Nobody looks over and goes man. They're starving all of us, but Joe is still [00:07:00] 300 pounds. Why is that? No because if you don't eat you get skinny, and if you do eat you can get fat. So can we both say people make decisions every single day.

To get fat whether they're ignoring their decisions are not ignoring the reality or not. They make a decision to keep eating and get fat. So their choices make them bigger. Is that is that true? Right? Okay. Yep. That is true. Can we also can parallel this to healthcare for a second? We know people who smoke cigarettes who drink alcohol who become obese.

You know that they end up with metabolic disorders that they end up spending a lot more of the quote-unquote Medicare and health care money because they have lots of diseases when other people who stay lean eat healthy get to sleep on time train regularly. They tend not to really use the system as much would we agree on that?

I agree and. I want to put one more thing out there. Dr. Jeff and you're going to love this analogy. Feel free to use [00:08:00] it. There are groups of people out there who say well you can be obese and still be healthy and to them I say you can jump off of a 100 story building and still be alive at the 54th floor, but you're gonna die at the end.

You're going to hit the ground and die. So don't tell me about your obese person that still healthy right now. No, I mean, yeah, I'm not even a comment on that because that's just the most ridiculous thing. But you know what you were right. I mean when you look at you know Healthcare, why do I have to pay the same that the other person who is not healthy has to pay the same right if I get homeowner's insurance and I use it my rates go up right?

My neighbor's doesn't go up. He didn't use it. So why isn't Health Care the same way? I mean, you know, the people who are unhealthy should be paying more automobile insurance is the same if your high-risk you pay more and that's because that [00:09:00] is how they calculate their profits. They calculate their profits based on the people who don't use it's called breakage who don't you exact and the same is true of the airline's they calculate their profits on the people aren't fat.

They charged enough to get or everybody who's fat there. But if you're not mad and there's breakage, they're not paying for the gas because you didn't make it burn no and they probably calculate off of an overweight. There was a recently a situation where the airlines charge the guy for two seats.

And then at the last minute they put somebody in that seat in the guy was like you can't put someone in this I paid for two seats and they're like, no seat empty we filled. Oh, but did he still have to pay for it? Well, he had already paid for it because he was overweight. Yeah, I don't think I don't think I do there.

That's not fair. You know, they were they were yeah, they were arguing about it. And you know, I didn't feel like [00:10:00] listening to it because you know, I just was trying not to laugh, you know, because I thought , and it did this would be easy to do right because. Because yeah, they've got the healthcare industry has your entire dossier of everything you've done since the day you were born.

They can look at you and go. Wow. This person doesn't use the system which will give them a preferred rate and this person uses the system a lot. So they have to pay for how much they use it. But the problem is the sick people won't pay a thousand fifteen or they'll say, oh I can't afford 1500 of month and see.

If we did that for a while it would suck for a decade for some people. Yeah, but then people would get it. Oh, it's gonna cost me a lot more if I make stupid decisions and the same is true of the airline's they could do it when you buy an airline ticket, they could say click your weight group. 68 to 200 they you click your way group.

[00:11:00] Now how many bags you carry? And they already charge you fifty dollars a bag then they put it on the back on a scale. Yeah. Yeah, they could do but over way you pay more they could do it and then when you get there and they go, oh you Joe's the 168 to 191 group, but you're clearly have your step on the scale and then they would change your rate right there and it can be done.

It can be done. Yeah. You know, what would happen is All The Advocates and groups would be suing everybody because it's discrimination and yada yada yada. Well, I'll tell you about an airline. That's got it on right American Airlines has a Hawaiian Division and it's called Hawaiian Airlines and back in 2016.

They won a lawsuit. For the right to weigh passengers in the Samoan Islands because they had regular rates for the infant for the mainland right where they figure oh 50% of the people under 300 pounds in like okay, then we could do our math when they started doing the [00:12:00] same thing for the Samoan Islands.

They go home in the Samoans are really big people even the ones that aren't fat or really big people. So they want they filed a suit. And they won and now to this day they charge passengers by their weight. Hmm interesting so it can be done and look at the people that are thin you're going to make out.

Yeah, cuz you can charge my weight. So, you know, somebody tiny or like a child you're going to pay less, right? Yeah exactly. You're going to pay less to take your children. You're going to pay less if you happen to be a lean person heck. Yeah, I'll bet you money. Dr. J that travel will go up because people who are like a hundred seventy pounds of be like, oh man this round trip airfare is only 220 dollars.

I'm doing this. Yeah. Well, that's one of the reasons why you know, and then. Government needs to get rid of all those extra taxes, you know hundred $99 plus two hundred dollars in taxes [00:13:00] and this and that that's a whole other story. But you know, I'm telling you man, if somebody needs to start to push back on these two industries and say yeah, it's unfair what you're doing and there is a way to fix both of them charge people for what they use to charge people that travel by them equipment because dr.

J if you ship a package. And if you don't yeah, I ship a package. That's 40 pounds. I don't get mad while his package is only $13. Why is mine 4000 because it's heavy. Oh, okay. Yeah, you know what? I mean? It would be the same way when the airline started charging for bags. I mean, I remember years ago when I used to fly, you couldn't carry anything on they literally had a little box up there and if your briefcase didn't fit into that you had to check.

And you only got one check bag and if you already checked a bag you get charged for it and then I started watching people. I used to say I'm [00:14:00] going to come up with a spray that people can spray on their bags because they tried to cram these big old bags in the overhead cam said I can agree. Yeah. I thought I could make a fortune on it, you know Grease the bag first and then they started doing all that, you know, and again, it's.

It's out of control as far as the weight issue. So now the airlines because they're allowing people to carry so much junk on, you know are compensating that and that's one of the reasons why the fares are so expensive, you know, because they know people are going to bring these big roller boards on and that's I'm paying for all these roller boards, right?

You know, I'm a frequent flyer, you know, so I've earned the right to get a free bag. You know, but my bag has to be under the 50 pounds. These people are carrying more than 50 pounds because they don't weigh those bags right that they bring on the plane. Great Point. That's a great point and we're [00:15:00] paying for that along with their being overweight.

Yeah, we this is and let me say that I by no means him some little guy who's gonna like this is not I'm not saying this because I'm self-interested like yeah, I could get a damn 232 pounds, but I'm all for me paying my fair share. I got a bet you that are 232 pounds. My airfare would still be less than what they're charging me right now blindly.

You know, they all yeah, you know round trip is $640. I'll bet you anything that if they did way me and my one carry-on my airfare would be cheaper. Anyway, it would be and you know people who are heavier. Okay, you would pay a little bit more. That's lose weight. Yeah, you have an option, you know.

Nobody is forcing you to carry that weight. Maybe that would be a good way for them to get in shape. No one they're going to pay more for getting on an airplane and I know there and you know, you made a good point II [00:16:00] about your shoulders, right? So I am not obese, but I do have very broad shoulders and when I get on a plane and sit down, I roll my shoulders forward and cross my arms in front of me so that my shoulders stay went in.

Armrest because I don't want to just because I have broad shoulders. I don't want to lean against the person next to me and make them feel uncomfortable and you share an armrest. So how does that work you each get half of an armrest. I and I do the same way. I try to be polite. I put mine inside the armrest right, but then that's the person next to me that you know on the armrests and all over in the you know in the me and.

Martin like the weight of the by rule is by mental rule is this if I'm on the aisle seat I get the right arm rest to me. That's my auras. If you're in the middle you choose the left of the right basically and if you're on the [00:17:00] window-seat the left arm rest is yours. So you lean to the left. I lean to the right and the person in the middle of the gun straight.

I mean I do that out of courtesy. Well, you know a lot of people aren't courteous. That's the whole issue. There is no when they start the plane a set of all that safety stuff. They ought to add a little bit about being courteous kind of like Jim courtesy, you know, yeah. Yeah explain how you said how you keep your legs underneath you.

Don't put them over in your neighbors aisle. And if the person doesn't want to talk leave them alone. Yes. Yes, you know why I took cuz I I I'm a talkative guy. But when the plane is moving I if I look to the left or to the right I get a little motion sickness. Okay, a quick funny story. I was coming out of Amsterdam and I'm in the back of the plane and this young gal comes down.

She's carrying a baby. I'm on the aisle. I stand [00:18:00] up she says I'm in this row she goes here would you hold this and she literally gives me her baby. As she gets into her seat UK hitting these days. No, so I give her back the baby and I sit down in my seat. She's in the middle plane takes off and pretty soon.

I start hearing this smacking noise. I'm like what the heck is this? I looked over she had taken her top off had both nibs out and the baby was sitting there going to town both of them kind of like, I mean, it's one thing to take a breast out and then cover with the blanket, but she had have she was completely.

Was completely exposed and she was all hanging over my chair. And you know, I mean, I was actually embarrassed. I was like, oh my goodness man. I would have offered call. I would have offered ordered coffee and said I gotta know what I did. I don't know what I did. I was it was it was a long flight from Amsterdam to New [00:19:00] York.

I bet look I want you opened up another can of worms. You poked the bear. I want to talk about gym etiquette when we come back because this is really a good segue from this discussion. We'll be right back. Welcome back to science for humans. We're having a little fun today instead of talking about heavy science.

We're talking about some funny stuff. Sure. We pistol a lot of people. I think I should have said I should have said the etiquette thing, you know, that's I don't have very many pet peeves, but the gym is one of them, right? Like I'm I don't care you can spit accidentally spit on my shoes and I'll be like I don't worry about it.

But so my biggest pet peeve in the gym biggest one is working in if I'm using a machine and you're on a schedule and you're like you need that machine to come on over brother or sister get in there do your thing will work in well, I'm resting you use it. I hate [00:20:00] people and hate is a strong word, but I'm using it specifically.

Who think they're renting the Machine by the hour they sit there and if you come over you go you mind if I work in they look at you go. I just have three more sets like they get angry with you and I say look you're resting. Let me do a set.

That's one of mine. I got to number one. The people that don't put the weights away. I hate put other people's weights away. And some of them are women a lot of times people say, oh it's only guys, but when I go into a machine and there's two and a half pound plates on there. I'm sorry some lady left those plates on put your plates away, but my biggest one is the towel Slingers who will get six tiles and they'll drape towels on all kind of machines because they're doing CrossFit train.

And you'll walk up and you'll see a towel. I'll look around if I don't see anybody that [00:21:00] super setting then I'm jumping in. I remember last year. I was doing chest and I look no one was on the decline, but there was a towel I did my inclines took me 15 minutes went over. Did three sets of declines now, we're into 20 25 minutes and some guy comes up and goes while I'm using that I go.

No, you're not he goes. Well, I would just went outside to run around the parking lot. And then I was in the gym doing jumping jacks, and then I was using this and I'm like dude you see where your towel is. It's on the floor. I said when I'm done you can have it and I don't like to be rude but you know these towel slingers man, they'll never know I was on everything.

I don't see that in my gym. Thank God, but that would piss me off. So basically you bring six towels to the gym you drop them on six machines. And those are your workout machines for the rest of the time until you take [00:22:00] your towel off and on. Yeah, nobody. Nobody can do one guy did it in the in the leg area and tied up all the lake stuff and I'm like no, you can't do this if you want a super set, you know, go ahead you can't put towels on everything because that's what you're going to do for the next two hours.

Sorry, buddy. Unbelievable. I haven't seen that's his that's worse in my opinion. That's worse than super said it then. Then working in because at least the person is sitting there where you can say to them. Do you mind if I work in buddy and most people do go? Yeah, sure jump in here, but you have the occasional like I had a guy a couple weeks ago who said that to me said, you know, I just have three more.

And I said, yeah, but you're just sitting there texting right now. Can I just do a Saturday? And he grumbled? You know, he begrudgingly. Let me use the machine and when he was walking away. He said [00:23:00] something under his breath and I said to him F you you're not renting the Machine by the hour.

We all pay the same membership fee here. You know it people don't understand. They shouldn't even work out if they don't understand, you know how to get along with people in the gym. You know, I never if somebody says can I work in sure, you know, I'm not training for a contest now back when I was training for a contest.

No, because I'm moving fast. I don't have time to wait for you. I have a training partner, but you know, no one's in the gym training for a contest and if you are, you know, you're not bothering them we had I was super setting to machines right next to each other and this gal comes up and she goes I want to use that.

And I said you can work in no. No. No, I want that machine. Well, we're super setting when we get done. You can have it. You can't do that. That's illegal and I'm like ma'am [00:24:00] you can she can work in you said she could you can you can jump in and where you can work in? No, I want the machine. Well, then you're going to have to wait so she goes up to the front desk and I don't know what she says the manager comes out then she sees that you know who it was and I'm.

Like what is this guy's problem? Well, she wanted to do one set there and she just didn't want you around there. I'm like, well, you know what it's open now. She can have it. No she left. So you think she didn't want you to watch her training in other words. She didn't want you to stay. I don't know.

I have no idea. She's you know, she's one of those people that they just do a set here then they go over here and do a set and they do a set and do a set. You know, I mean, they don't really have any plan workouts, but you know when they picked that they are [00:25:00] going to use this machine. Well, I want it now get off of it.

You know, I blame the gyms for this. I really do. Yeah, every gym should have posted around the gym the basic gym etiquette and we know what they are, right, you know, let people work in wipe your machine down rear rack your weights. I mean, they're very simple. We all know them we can recite them and now in newer times turn your cell phone ringer to silent.

Leave your cell phone in your gym bag. I use I don't mind I use my cell phone to record my but I turned my ringer off and I don't take calls in the gym. I just don't there was a guy on a preacher bench preacher curl machine. He's doing a set his phone rings and all of a sudden he lowers the weight and he's doing one arm and he's talking on the phone.

I watched him do this for over 30 minutes. He tied up that machine. One arm at a time. Yeah, I mean but took [00:26:00] put it down the like five pounds. I mean it wasn't even worth doing right and I didn't want it but I was just this is interesting what this guy doing and I look back. He's still on that machine talking on the phone you shitting me.

Right. I mean I get it if you're a doctor you're a brain surgeon of a brain just was flown in from another state cryogenically frozen and you got to get it into this guy's head quickly. I get it turn your ringer on because you need to go but if your ringer is on and somebody is dead lifting or bench pressing or squatting really significant weight and your ringer goes off even though your ringer.

Doesn't sound exactly like there's it's a natural response to become distracted by the ringer. Just turn the phone on silent and vibrate and put it in your pocket. And if you want to take a call that answer it and say hold on a second. Let me get off the gym floor and then go creep into the [00:27:00] corner and take your call.

But that's Jim and I know it. And I know what somebody's thinking what you guys just got done saying that people should pay by the pound. You guys should pay by the pound by what you lift. The ship should be missed. Okay. Good point. Yeah. Yeah. It really may be a stronger guys should be paying more, h?

Yeah. Okay. Well, right that's pretty funny your will give you that one. You're funny. You're funny. Hey, so anyway, that was I think we filled that half hour with some humorous but logical stuff. Let's see who like that was good. Yeah, kind of pre Olympia. So I'll be out the Olympia this weekend.

Anyone going to be in Las Vegas. Come on by the EFX Sports Booth. Love to see you. Yeah, come say hello to dr. J. Tell him you love him on super human radio, I brother. All right. Okay. Take care.

Okay, we're going to take a break and when we come back I have something to talk about before Jason for Gia comes on. You [00:28:00] would think I set the world on fire yesterday. With the not yesterday, but Monday with Patrick Darlings interview with one comment, he made and everybody challenging me that sugar alcohol becomes sugar in the body.

Well, where's the studies? Where's the research? Well, I got the studies in the research and I'm going to tell you about it when we come back stay tuned. Welcome back. So Monday, I did an interview with Patrick died.

Patrick Dolan is a biochemist. He's been on the show Numbers times. He he's the guy who came on the show and broke the news that beef is the only food that actually increases telomere lengths of those of you who are into anti-aging. But then avoid beef. Well, I don't know to call you without insulting you but Patrick is a guy who's on The Cutting Edge and one of the things I've learned about Patrick by having them on the show is he doesn't just look at research du jour everybody looked at the research today and it doesn't look at the research that it's been [00:29:00] built on and he finds magic in some of these studies that he looks at.

So, I love to email Patrick and say hey Patrick. What do you most passionate about now? And he tells me a number let's do a show on it. The guy who's always on The Cutting Edge. He really is and. I emailed him a couple weeks ago and he said, you know, I know you probably want to hear about the keto diet again, but I have some really shocking news about the foods that people are thinking are good for the keto diet.

But that really aren't I says he sent me the research he sent me all the stuff and I was like, dude, let's do this. I knew that there was going to be a response. I just didn't know how big the response would be. First of all the traffic to the website is just insane. I did a little one minute snippet video.

That's actually on Facebook and it's getting shared a lot. I also shared it to Instagram. It seems to be getting [00:30:00] shared a lot as well. And the one thing that people keep coming back and going you know, this is BS. I've been eating sugar alcohol. So Patrik came on the show and said sugar alcohols turn into sugar in the gut.

No can't be impossible. I use sugar alcohols and my blood sugar doesn't go up. Well, you got to look at insulin c-peptide and Insulin in order to see if your blood sugar is going up just because you're the reading in your glucometer isn't changing doesn't mean your body didn't just pump out a smidge more insulin to compensate for the added sugar that just hit your.

You know, it's like I've used this analogy before trying to guess what your body is doing with Sugar by looking at your blood sugar levels is kind of like trying to figure out how fast you're going by looking at how far your foot and your gas pedal off from the floorboard you.

So a lot of people push back, this is BS. This is nonsense. Where are the studies where the study? [00:31:00] Well, there are studies actually, but the problem is that they're not new studies. So nobody pays attention to them. We're so myopic when it comes to the history of Science and the research that's been done in the past.

Like I did a show not too long ago about quick and pollen. They're the guys who started the whole keto diet phenomenon back in the 50s. Well in 1966 a study was published by KH Bassler base. It was in a clinical nutrition Journal it's hard to find but it's there. It's called inhibition of fatty acid oxidation as a factor in the anti ketogenic effects of sugars and poly alcohols fast forward to 2019 75.

A study was done by AK Rawat our aw 80 and I'm spelling them for you. So Bassler is spelled B-a-s-sl-e-r first and middle initial KH published in 1966 inhibition of fatty acid oxidation is a factor in the anti ketogenic effects of sugars and poly alcohols. The other study is called anti ketogenic actions of fructose glyceraldehyde and sorbitol which is a sugar alcohol in [00:32:00] the rat in Vivo.

That was in 1975. So while all these people out there going. This is BS, it's impossible this can't happen you just you just aren't looking for enough for the answers. You got to go back this research was done a long time ago when the whole ketogenic phenomenon in the 50s started to emerge people started looking at it back then she what are the things that shut down ketosis.

So don't get mad at me and Patrick don't hate on The Messengers. Look at this and go wow. Maybe this is something interesting. There's a lot of people out there who claim to be on very strict ketogenic diets, and I see them posting on different face Board of Facebook walls. I'm not losing weight.

You know, I checked my Ketone meter. I'm not producing ketones Patrick said on the interview that he doesn't work with individuals, but occasionally someone will get to him and say, you know, I've been on the ketogenic diet for six months. I'm not losing weight. I'm not producing ketones. What am [00:33:00] I doing wrong?

And when he looks at their diet most often they are consuming large amounts of sugar alcohol. Because they're being told that has no impact on blood sugar when it actually does

I get it and pissing everybody off because their favorite dessert is turned out to be not that great. Me too. Me, too. I eat a lot of products with sugar alcohol. I talked to at least about it yesterday. She says what do we do? I said start counting them as sugar if your goal is to eat under 20 or 30 grams of sugar a day then make that sugar alcohols to it's simple you don't have to abandon what you're eating.

You just have to start tracking it more accurately and we're giving you information to help you track it accurately. That's all it means does it mean that I'm not going to abandon sugar alcohols? I don't abandon sugar this sugar and things that I eat too. I eat fruit and I'm also not looking for 2.5 millimoles of ketones because I don't have brain cancer.

[00:34:00] I'm just happy with .7, you know after I fast for 16 hours, I'm always at some Winnie of .70. I was I mean it just it just rudimentary for me and for many of you as well. I really don't think you need to be in that ridiculous 2.5 and 3.5. You know, like let me show you how big my wiener is. Oh, no, mine is bigger know that's it's not a contest who can have the highest Ketone levels.

If you're doing that then you're stupid. Unless you have cancer or seizures. That's a different story. That's a different story, but. You can still lose weight. You can still lose body fat by doing intermittent fasting and a carbohydrate controlled diet by keeping Ketone levels in that point seven or even one millimole range.

You're still going to lose weight.

But man I thought people going to come out go Carl you rock man. This is this is this is the answer now. I understand why I'm not having the progress that I thought. I was gonna have no instead they hating [00:35:00] on me because. It's like I just burst their bubble. I can't eat. I can't eat my favorite dessert.

Now know you can still eat it but just counted as sugar and understand it is going to probably suppress ketosis a little bit. Is it going to knock you out of ketosis completely? Probably not. Is it going to lower your Ketone production? Probably?

And if you're going to eat those things eat them around your work out eat and post workout or eat them before you workout and I'll have that brownie bar that you love so much. It has funeral 14 grams of sugar alcohol post my pre-workout have a part of your pre-workout meal. You can enjoy it and it and you know that it'll actually maybe help you train longer because we've talked about this on the show before.

In humans ketones and blood glucose occur at the same time. If you're in ketosis, it doesn't mean that you're not producing glucose. You're just producing less glucose because the brain or some other organs that happen to want glucose [00:36:00] at the moment are going to use it. But this all-or-nothing attitude has to stop I told you about my experience with.

Combining

designer carbohydrates with Ketone salts. I mean I was able to train longer. I felt better leaving the gym and and we know that ketones and glucose occur at the same time. It's like if you're producing ketones, it's not like as though all your glucose goes away. So just take it with a grain of salt.

No pun intended Ketone. So take it with a grain of Ketone salts and don't get angry because it's really just what Justice we're just learning more. That's all we're doing. We're just learning more add it to the information. You have and treat sugar alcohols more like you do sugar and watch what happens to your body like you go.

Oh, man. I'm losing so much more fat I get into ketosis a lot faster. Thank you Carl. Thank you Patrik Dahlin. So if you see the one-minute video pass it around because I think I gotta tell you there's more good stuff in [00:37:00] that interview like. That when you're on a high fat diet, which I am I eat I mean, I'll tell you my macronutrients so far today in a second, but if you want a high fat diet that actually consuming digestion resistant fibers not all fibers, but the digestion resistant ones.

Met actually at least it does in rodents increase the production of TMAO now whether or not you subscribe to the whole TMAO equals cardiovascular disease, that's another discussion. I don't necessarily subscribe to it. I don't but it is interesting that. If you want a high fat diet, whether you're on a ketogenic diet or you just on a standard American diet and you've gone off the rails with fat consumption digestion resistant fibers and carbohydrates starches.

They probably are not a good idea for you. If you subscribe to the TMAO equals cardiovascular disease discussion. And lastly the other piece of wisdom there was there's a ton of great information the first 15 minutes of the interview are for the newbies who don't know anything about ketosis and they stumbled onto the [00:38:00] show.

We don't want to start hitting them with stuff that they don't understand so we gave the first 15 minutes of talking about ketosis and what it does and how it works and all that sort of stuff. But after that Patrick darling dropped magical. Information that's going to help people. He also said aspartame if you're eating foods with aspartame in them and you are not using Ketone salts, but you are depending on your body to produce its own BHB which happens in the gut, right?

There's two microbes that. Work together to create BHB if you're eating aspartame, it blunts those microbes from being able to produce BHB. You know, there's people out there again, that is struggling Ike I don't produce ketones. I don't understand that. I can't lose weight on the stand it and then they go well, yeah, you know, I drink a lot of diet soda because it satisfies My Sweet Tooth.

Well, I think they use a lot of aspartame and diet soda still. So that could be something else you want to [00:39:00] look into try it experiment with it. Remove it from your diet for two three weeks. See if it has a positive impact and maybe it won't maybe it will because this is all individual all individual but at least we're peeling the onion and we're starting to go away.

We're learning more ironically. We're learning more by going back in time and looking at research that occurred from the 50s forward. We think that the ketogenic diet just was invented now because brilliant people like dr. Dominic D'Agostino and dr. Thomas Seyfried have Champion these diets as nutritional therapies to cure diseases but no bones about it.

The high-fat low-carbohydrate low-protein diet has been in existence since the 40s and the magic was really. Investigated in the 50s and so from the 50s and 60s and 70s. There was a lot of research being done on this diet. No one pays attention to that. We may we may be able to find things that we can avoid pitfalls by going back and looking at that research because new research doesn't always build [00:40:00] on Old research.

It doesn't you have to go back and read that stuff.

So I hope people appreciate and past the stuff around because let's get it out there let people make their own decisions and you know, don't be calling people Liars there is research to provide support for these things and I'm going to read them again real. I'll write them down inhibition of fatty acid oxidation as a factor in the anti ketogenic effects of sugars and poly alcohols by KH Bassler.

ER that was published in 1966 an anti ketogenic actions of fructose glyceraldehyde and sorbitol in the rat in Vivo. And that was published by AK Rawat are aw 80 in 1975. So grab those studies read them experiment with these modifications to your diet. See what happens. I want to hear from people I want I want to hear from people.

You know what Carl it didn't matter to me. I cut the sugar alcohol out and nothing changed. I cut the aspartame out. Nothing changed without getting a TMAO a test a TMAO [00:41:00] test. You're not going to know if digestion resistant fibers are hurting or helping you or wow. I took Patrick Darlings advice. I cut these things out and holy crap.

I was stuck in a plateau for six months and I just burst through it. I want to hear from people on air at super human radio dotnet. And that's it. We're going to take a break and when we come back, we're going to have Jason 4G on the show. He's a great guy lot of fun and he's going to teach us why 95% of the stuff on the internet that you read about Fitness is just dead wrong stay tuned.

Welcome back. So I was just a message and I did forget something at the end of last segment. I said, I was gonna reveal my current macros. So today I'm actually kind of cat. I've had zero carbs today. I've had a hundred 20 grams of fat and a hundred fifty two grams of protein. I've eaten almost a pound and a half of beef.

I've got three more meals to [00:42:00] go. I'm going to eat probably meet all day long, maybe some broccoli later. But yeah. I mean, I'm a high fat guy. And so if I did subscribe to the whole TMAO thing, then I would probably want to avoid digestion resistant starch because of its potential up regulation of production of TMAO my new my next guest is probably many of you know, who he is.

He's been around for a long time and he says. 95% of what you read about Fitness is dead wrong Jason 4G. How you doing Jason? All right. Great. Carl. Glad to be here. Thanks for having me. I got to meet Jason and person when I was out in Los Angeles and I actually did his podcast and that will probably be dropping in the next couple of weeks as well.

Thank you for having me on by the way. Yeah pleasure love it. So what's the tell people where you got started your no newcomer to this. There's a lot of newcomers that call themselves gurus, but you really qualify as a guru in this. [00:43:00] Yes, sir, win in 1987, I grew up in a small town in New Jersey and I was a skinny week insecure kid and I grew up watching Schwarzenegger and Stallone in the big screen and pro wrestling every Saturday morning.

And I want to be one of those larger than life kind of superheroes. But here I was just you know at first its kind of chubby kid overweight kid not the most athletic and then eventually just a skinny we kid. And in 1987, my cousin was dating. My cousin Christine was dating a pro wrestler named Eric and he was.

Not in WWF at the time but smaller Federation and he really got me into it. And so I went from doing nothing into seven days a week on a two-hour bodybuilding kind of worked out and I didn't get great results because it was a little bit of Overkill and overtraining at the time for a beginner, but I got you know, I got bit by the iron bug and I was hooked and addicted to physical culture from that day [00:44:00] on So eventually I was able to.

You don't stumble upon some of the older stuff and that's what started to change the game and give me some results when I was able to find Saxon and hackenschmidt and books like dinosaur training and super squats and the keys to progress by John McCallum and Anthony Dattilo and Vince gironda and all that kind of stuff.

So I just was obsessed with consuming everything I could reading everything I could. Back, then there were no there's no internet. There were no videos. There were no DVDs the order VHS tapes. So I've ordered many of those is that could got certifications and then eventually I started. I interned in the weight room during college and I got my first couple certifications I think maybe sophomore year college and I started training people not too long after that was still going to school and saved up enough money.

I put every dime back into the business and saved up enough money within two years to open my own. Grace and it was just a [00:45:00] small thousand square foot room in the basement was literally underground people talk about their underground. Jim's is literally underground and those days in 1996 that style of Jim really wasn't you know, today is everywhere.

It's on every street corner. We have tens of turf and sand bags and everything that was really unique at the time. So that was kind of the beginning. And you've trained a ton of pro athletes over the over the your career so far. I mean some big names of from the NFL and so on so people turn to you when they have to have results and that's important because I would venture to Guess that if we looked at the entire population of trainers out there, right hella strength trainers and so on and we tease out of them the ones that work for universities.

You know that that's their job. I would say that 98.9% of the trainers out there never really work with any professional athletes where it really matters if you know what you're talking about. Yeah, for sure. Yeah, I mean, [00:46:00] you know what he Morris who's a bit of pro strength coach with numerous NFL teams.

He said across I don't know if we're allowed to curse on here now, but he said I'm number one. Yeah, I will so I'm going to call him from Jersey. So I got to know I know me too man. But yeah the family friendly so you can use the letter F if you have to be there. Yeah, I got you. But he said your number one job of working with a high-level Elite athlete is not the FM up, you know, sometimes young trainers get too excited and they want to do all this cool, which is sometimes risky stuff with high-level athletes.

And you know before you get to that point you want to have worked with obviously a ton of high school athletes and college athletes. But you know, it's Kobe Bryant comes to you during the last year of his career someone at that level or even just a professional level. You have to really be careful really be smart really be using [00:47:00] fake joint friendly exercises because they're already a pro like you're not going to make them significantly better unless they've never trained before somehow that you can get those New Beginnings your best bet is to try to help them endure more help them not get injured as much help them become more resilient make them feel better.

Make them move well increase their longevity. If you take a pro guy and you treat them the same way you train a high school guy try to just improve all is Max's that doesn't always work that well again, you know, like I said unless a really new be a strength training. You've also been published a ton but in some big magazines, right?

I mean muscle and fitness Men's Health men's fitness ESPN. I mean, yeah, what are some of the early articles that kind of one you the attention? So I started blogging before we that was even a word in 2001 and that was garnering a lot of attention because I was saying things, you know, I was introducing some unique Training [00:48:00] Concepts of time and talking about things and maybe presenting ideas that people hadn't really been putting out there and thought of that much but I was also doing it.

With my kind of East Coast Jersey personality as well and you know telling stories making it entertaining giving my own unbiased uncensored opinion. So people really like that and then I got into it again back in those days of magazines were mainly about you know, five six seven days a week body part splits and we they were just ghost written articles by Pro bodybuilders and I started introducing.

The different way of training, you know, maybe more full body workouts or upper lower power building power lifting influence kind of athletic Based training the odd object the strongman stuff the body weight stuff mixed in and it was really unique at the time. So II started I think I started in in men's fitness.

And then I got an Intel open all different magazines and eventually got my own column for quite a few years in men sitting is that [00:49:00] was a hardgainer column. And for those who don't know hardgainers just kind of a skinny guy, you know with small joints and has trouble gaining size. So what works typically for average people are people better than average X doesn't really work.

That's the guy who's going to really fight for every ounce of muscle. So I do some concept there, you know some lower volume trainings. Focus on Progressive overload and compound movements and staying away from all the stuff that the magazines were advocating so and it is it is it the hardgainers main problem that they just don't eat enough quite frankly it is.

Yeah. I mean definitely they don't eat enough, but they're all so that's one thing but what I think a lot of people don't understand or there's a misconception about hard gainers is they're super high anxiety. They're super high stress. And as you know any form of stress, you know compromises your results your body have to recover from it.

So it's not just recovering from lifting. It has to be cover from that high [00:50:00] anxiety the fact that you're not sleeping you have smaller joints. So some of the bigger compound lifted. Everyone says they're so great. Maybe those take a little bit more out of you than they do for some people so, you know, you got a manager lifestyle as well, you know didn't listen to this is really interesting because this is something I've really.

Wrapping my head around more and more lately, right? It started about two years ago when a study was done on postmenopausal women and that the more they train the less body fat they lost and they read and they relegated them to being high stress. So when your body perceives stress from the environment, it doesn't realize you want to lose body fat.

It just says, wow, the environment is trying to kill us we'd better lower. Metabolic rate let's save calories because life sucks. Right? And so when I first read that study, I was like this is interesting. This is probably not just postmenopausal women this probably premenopausal women this probably guys too and then I started thinking [00:51:00] back.

I started thinking about in two thousand two three four and five when I was training, I was so strong. I looked forward to going to the gym and I left the gym feeling like an animal and I started to realize it was because I arrived at the gym feeling like an animal and my workouts didn't crush me.

They acting made me feel better. And I thought I wonder how much stress played a role. Well the perception that I wasn't stressed played a role in that success that I had back then now fast-forward. I'm 60. I've got injuries. I've broken some stuff now, you know tricep reattachment three hamstring attachments on the left hamstring one on the right torn a bicep now.

I'm like a little oh man, you know, you start getting scared the allostatic load of training stuff to be in your mind and I so because of this. The past week I started Sunday doing a whole body routine, but only doing only doing two sets of everything because I'm going to do this every [00:52:00] day. So I don't want to crush myself on the day one or day two or day three and so I'm doing whole body.

I mean everything neck down except my legs because my footage and still need surgery in November. So I'm doing leg extension leg curls and I did do some very light leg pressing yesterday, but. I did this routine three days in a row and yesterday when I went to the gym, I felt like King Kong this morning when I woke up.

I noticed my pulse was elevated. I thought -h. I'm starting to flirt with overtraining. I'm going to take off today and eat like a friggin animal. I've already eaten two pounds of beef so far today, and I still have three more meals to go. So I'm starting to really become a believer of what you just said and I think.

What you just said the Nuance of it is missed by most people that that one thing their perception because of the way they're training their perception of the work that they're doing actually could [00:53:00] be holding them back speak about that. Yeah. Yeah. Well, you know, there's so many points in touch on there one.

I just want to say it's funny that you're training like that because that's actually how I train now. II started in the beginning of 2017. I've been doing upper lower split for a really long time and once in a while do some Push Pull lower splits, but the beginning of 2017 is switched over to 3 full-body workouts.

I did that for the majority of 2017 except when I would train with a friend or a podcast. Yes, and they were doing something different. I would just jump in this year. I've been doing four to six full body workout. That's an average of five per week. And I have the same exact effect that you decide.

I feel better. I do very similar to about two sets. I never get for I never feel overtrained. My strength is as good as it's ever been. I'm never fatigued because again think about if you're doing 10 sets a week, there's a lot [00:54:00] of experts in the science that shows its headsets a week for body parts a good number you could argue that but let's say that for the sake of this ten cents a week.

If you do 10 sets of chest on Monday, you're going to be destroyed. You're so for take a lot out of your immune system your CNS and everything. You kind of beat up your fraud. Now, if you do two sets five days, like you and I are doing you never gets or you never get overly fatigue. You always feel pretty good.

It's pretty easy. And for me, I found that it's easier to stay lean. I mean, I'm 44 in the leanest I've ever been and I feel like the training has got to contribute to that because let's say you 15 sets total per workout. I was just doing 15 sets of chest shoulders and tries that's not going to burn as many calories and have as much of an actor burn effect.

Is it as if I'm doing chin-ups presses squats or dlls heavy carries, [00:55:00] you know what I mean? So that's so interesting that you're doing that because well you're a believer in that maybe the one of the things that I've been wrestling with for a decade now is looking more at looking at training more like work.

So you and I are equals Italian Guys. We know a lot of guys who are bricklayers probably uncles and grandfathers we come we you and I come from working breeds. You know what I mean? We were made to work hard every single day. So. When you when you have a when you're a manual laborer, you don't go to work saying I'm going to crush it today.

I'm going to work so hard then I'm going to go home and be exhausted and not be able to work tomorrow. No, you gotta you gotta you gotta break it I gotta I gotta come here five days. I got to get all this work done. But I have five days to do it. And that is why I started thinking you know what I'm just gonna do two sets [00:56:00] of everything.

Undulate the wait, I'll undulate the Reps different days how I feel, but by the same thing you said but by the end of the week, I did 10 sets of this but I didn't do it in a way that I purposely went out to kill myself and that perception of stress. All of a sudden is gone. Yeah. Yeah. Well see in speaking to that you can the only do something once a week.

You have that stress right? Like oh my God. I have to set a PR have to go up. I'm only going to hit this exercise in this movement pattern or body part once every seven days you put a lot of stock into it mentally like you're talking about there and then that ends up crushing you and overtraining and you do that all five days because if you're only hitting a body part once a week, well, this is my only time to hit shoulders my only time to hit back so I'm going to go all out.

Versus what we're doing you have an [00:57:00] off day. If you have a busy day a stressful day you go in. Hey you go through the motions you maybe you're down 10 pounds. So what you're back at it again, you going to hit it two or three more times that week it doesn't matter and that's how life Works anyway. I mean like there's no sport where you try to go linearly up and you always go super hard all the time.

You would burn out. So training in this manner is more just you know, physiologically how your body really works and there's a lot of days where. I'm stronger and then some days I'll go in and I'm weaker and I don't stress out about I'm just okay, dude, that's just the Ebbs and flows.

That's how it work. And it also prevents me from getting injured. I used to get injured all the time. Every few months me know how it is in the train. You're always nicked up. I never get banged up anymore me knock on wood because I trained in this [00:58:00] fashion last year and it's 44 feel better than ever.

The other thing is, you know, speaking of that high intensity. You just can't go high intensity every day and like you mentioned earlier about the women in the study. I have people come real hard times. They say well, I can't lose fat and I said, what are you doing? First of all every workout try intensity and every cardio interval or hit Josh is hit high intensity.

And I said, okay, here's what we're going to do 0 high intensity for the next 30 days and they freak out. But the reality is then their body program just you know, really humping cortisol out 24/7. So now they can actually lose fat because that stress isn't there. So, let's reduce the training volume which reduce the intensity.

Let's not go to failure all the time. Let's not do these crazy workouts and on a few days a week for cardio instead of going nuts and doing sprints. You just going to maintain steady state for 30 minutes and that's going to be [00:59:00] better for you. I want to make one more supposition and have you comment on it then?

We're going to take a break. I'm going to come out back and tell people why 95% of the stuff they hear out there is nonsense. So there's something else I've discovered and I have a feeling you're going to say. Yes you too. I am a lot stronger and here's why because when I knew I had to do five sets of something that first set.

Okay. So my first set of something is the hardest that my second set is the easiest. And so when you only do two sets you end up being stronger because you know, oh I'm going to push as hard as I can because all I got is two sets. I don't have five grueling sets to do where I'm actually mentally governing my output because I'm like, oh man, I got one more set.

I can't do all of this right now. I'm going to save this for the next set when you just have two sets to do you [01:00:00] well because you're going to be done then yeah. A hundred percent and your there was a study recently. I'd have to look it up and find it but they compared the training five times a week wears a 2 times a week for frequency and the five-time group and we I believe it was experience trainees the five times.

I had better results across the board sure here that goes I thought about that for years to like you said because I grew up every summer throughout High School. I work manual labor and when you know when I think back on it, then those guys were doing that every single day. Like you said they weren't going to failure.

They were killing them. What some of those guys were strong as could be and had enormous backs and forearms and could pick up and endurance and endurance? Yeah, and they were drinking a case of beer during the day doing it. But things crazy. I've said that if we could just you know, what I'd love to do.

I love to travel around [01:01:00] to job sites and teach these guys about the quality sleep the effect of quality sleep and the right way to eat. They could all be like super humans if they just stopped going out and pounding down a case of beer after work every single day, you know. Half the guys I work with they were drinking on the job.

He started 12 amazing. I was going to take a quick commercial break when we come back. We're going to talk about why 95% of the stuff that you read out there about Fitness is dead wrong with talking with Jason for Gia. His website is http://jasonferruggia.com . If you've never heard of him, you've been living under a rock stay tuned.

We'll be right back with more super human radio.

Welcome back to super human radio. Talking with Jason for Gia and as you can see Jason is the thinking man's trainer just from the I mean that was totally improv. We didn't plan on talking about that stuff. But now I can see why 95% of what people read about [01:02:00] Fitness is dead wrong, but we I mean, that's a strong statement Jason.

Can you can you provide backing on that? Well, I think you know mainstream people still maybe your audience probably is obviously a lot more educated. You know, I have conversations people still all the time. We think that if they touch a carbohydrate there they're going to blow up and get fat and.

You know, they think again all cardio should be high intensity or workout to be high intensity and that's hard to get through to people, you know, nowadays when every Nike and Adidas commercial is all about people just training into their at a pool of their own Blood Sweat and totally wiped out it's hard to let people know that you can make progress without training.

That hard all the time. I think there's still a lot of people who are really confused about how frequently you have to train hard you have to train that you eat need to eat six or seven meals a day like he did in the eighties or nineties. I [01:03:00] believe you do intermittent fasting. I've done intermittent fasting for quite a while.

Now, you know, there's so many things that I think I don't even know where to begin making go on and on well, so. And it and it's not just the lone social media personal trainer looking for clients that's wrong. It's some of the more well-established bastions and I'll give you an example. So Ron Penna convinced me and II really don't pay attention to my nutrition anymore because I'm not really looking to get anywhere other than stronger, but I'm pretty close to being lean.

I mean I can see my abs and I feel like you know, if I really put some effort into this I would lean out and Ron said why don't you download MyFitnessPal because they make tracking your food very easy. So I did and it's been helping a lot but I posted this on Facebook yesterday the day before so I did one of those one-hour sessions that we you and I were just talking about this whole body session.

And you know, [01:04:00] I mean, I'm working friggin hard for an hour non-stop. I'm not rest in the arm rest in a minute and a half two minutes in between doing something and they gave me 20 calories for that. As a you know, as like you can eat 20 calories more and I'm thinking to myself. Clearly this organization which has an amazing product.

Like Alisa said to me I worked out in the yard yesterday for 30 minutes. They gave me two hundred and twenty calories for that and I'm thinking to myself so she went out in the yard for two different for 30 minutes and granted, you know, you're bending over you walking you're moving but I'm bending over I'm walking and I'm moving but I'm doing it with the heavyweight and they give me 20 calories for an hour and they give her like 200 calories for.

Minute, they don't even understand it do they? Yeah. No, not at all. It's not that but you know that that's such a great representation of what the majority of the general [01:05:00] public still think is that. If you do more cardio based workouts, or if you do High Reps on stuff and it's a shame. I mean you do see a ton of females now lifting heavy weights, but there's still definitely a decent percentage of them who you see in your heart kind of breaks when you see them in the gym using light weights and High Reps and trying to quote-unquote get toned and to lose fat tone and I see in the you know all the time.

I just want to go over to them and say look if you just lifted some heavy weights and didn't come to the gym 7 days a week. Maybe just came through three or four or five days and just lifted heavy just did a few sets like you and I are talking about that would be you make such better progress. I said, I can't reiterate it up every time I take someone and just lower their training volume a little put them on some big compound exercises focus on Progressive overload.

I think that's [01:06:00] what a lot of people don't know is. You don't take it for granted, but people go to the gym all the time and do the same work out or they'll just try to get tired. We'll just try to sweat and that really does very little for you. Just trying to tired or you go play basketball or some do something else and I were farming going to the gym.

You have to lift heavy weight and you have to go up. So if you can. Deadlift 95 pounds today you want to be working your way up to within three months or whatever 135 and then eventually 185 and 225, right and whatever exercise you're doing Progressive overload is really important. Now some people will say well you can't you can't.

Focus on Progressive overload forever your get in your deal would have been training 10 20 years. Definitely. That's true. You can't linearly go up but you can change your program and do new exercises so that you're still able to set PR. Let's say you always do a flat dumbbell, [01:07:00] press well now do a 30 degree dumbbell, press one arm at a time and put fat gripz on it.

Now, you can set PR's on that and even if you're older, You don't have to set a fiber up the arm instead of 12 rep PR. There's always ways to continually go up and make progress and challenge your body. And if you're not doing that, you're not going to make any progress. You're not going to get anywhere not going to change the way you look you're not going to get stronger.

So always focus on strength gains. And that's another misconception to is when I say that there's still people think I'm only talking about, you know, the one to five rep range, which is. Traditionally if you want to get strong you focus on that, but if you're older, you know, that that's going to tend to catch up to you after a while.

You can't just do one to five when you get strong in training for a long time. You can always make sure I can even if [01:08:00] it's 20 reps know you can do a higher up dumbbell row. I can do a 20 reps dumbbell row. I used to be able to do with a hundred sixty pounds on but I don't know what I could do with more now, but you can make progress doing that amazing, right?

To use heavy weights for High Reps, you're going to make progress just as long as you focus on making probably don't go to the gym and do the same thing. Don't be haphazard. Don't not track what you're doing. Don't just try to sweat. Don't just try to be out of breath. That's another misconception to is people think if they're not resting they're going to make more progress.

So they're if they're out of breath or burning more calories, not necessarily true. I mean if you're truly training, too, To make strength gains a progressive overload besides the show. You probably gonna need about two to three even up to five minutes rest between sets. Now the caveat to that is that can be boring.

That's why I like whole [01:09:00] body workouts that you and I are doing because let's say if you do a bench, press That's it is sitting around doing nothing for three minutes. We can do a one-arm row in between that you do a goblet squat we could do a kettlebell swing a chin-up, whatever. And take let's say 30 to 60 seconds rest, but if we if we, you know circuit three or four of those exercise now by the time we get back to the bench, press well.

I've gotten that three four five minutes rest. He was still able to be stronger on that set of bench presses than if you just took 30 seconds or 60 seconds doing straight. That's why I tend to like pairing two three four exercises in a row just to save time celebrity trainers. Tend to use that term tone a lot like Tracy Anderson when she works with Gwyneth Paltrow, who by the way Gwyneth Paltrow at the young age of whatever she is has already had fractures from osteoporosis.

So she's not doing she whoever's advice. She's following somebody [01:10:00] needs to intervene. But with that being said, let's talk about. The actual terminology the tonic state of muscle and toning and the misconceptions and you know, when you read about human physiology you understand that nerve innervation when it is effective creates what is known as muscle tone but muscle tone is not what people think it is if you think of it as the electricity that's running into the muscle.

So imagine you have a car and it's idling your car is idling at Thousand RPMs. The second you hit the gas pedal. It's off the line. I have a car that doesn't run too well, and it's sputters a little bit. So it idles down at 400 RPM when I hit the gas pedal. It doesn't launch off the line. It putts it sputters a poop up and then all of a sudden it goes before.

That is what we talk about when we talk about the tonic state of muscle. We talk about nerve innervations ability to activate that muscle quickly and people think muscle tone means the muscle is [01:11:00] firm know if you train the muscle it'll get firm. There's not specific training approaches to creating a firm muscle, right?

Right. Yeah, exactly. I mean basically from what people are Tracy Anderson, whoever when they're saying tone There's real really no signs of definitions of that word and that usage it's really just building muscle like you said or it's losing fat and then you going to look better. So when someone says oh your arms will tone.

Well, that's because you built muscles you made them bigger price and you lost some body fat. That you know, you're able to see your biceps your triceps your shoulders things like that. Now, of course, there's guys that really believe in the benefits of heavy lifting that will argue. Well, if you lift heavy weights, if you lift, you know, 80 85 percent of your one rep max on the majority of stuff.

You're resting toll-like. You'll look better all the time. Your muscles will look more full versus if you just do High Reps and pump up. Focus more on sarcoplasmic hypertrophy that certainly [01:12:00] arguable. I think that's more of a genetic thing. I think no matter how you lift. As long as it's smart, you know, not with 50 reps.

But if you're you know lifting somewhere and six to Fifteen reps, even 20 reps and making Progressive overload and your lean, you're probably gonna look pretty similar. You can increase the quote-unquote tightness or fullness just by carb-loading so the things like that you can do but I don't think the way you lift is going to make a huge.

You know, it's interesting. You just said something else that that dawned on me. And the reality is that the phenomenon of having quote unquote tone muscle may have more to do with being Ultra lean and having very little subcutaneous fat and no one talks about that. That's all diet that all happens in the kitchen that has nothing to do with how you're working out.

See that's the huge misconception that's really hard to get through the most people I've had friends and I've done it myself. I've had friends get ready for [01:13:00] photo shoots. You can for competitions doing very little cardio doing minimal low volume strength training workouts. I mean what my friend John from Jersey he used to compete against Jay Cutler was a multi-time.

Mr. Olympia. He got in his best shape. You have to be competing this point you got his best shape in his late thirties early forties for a photoshoot one time and he was doing triplet average of triples you go to the gym and you triple through heavy five do some singles. He did almost no cardio. I think he just got up and walked his dog for a half hour in the morning and just a moderate pace.

Any we going to die and he got down to 6% body fat. I mean you can get down to not that it's the greatest thing health-wise long-term, but you could do zero cardio and zero high intensity training just with low reps with long rest periods and still be really lean. It's all diet. Like you said, I think it's diet sleep stress.

Those are the most important [01:14:00] things if you're not sleeping and you're stressed out and your cortisol is just flowing all day. You're never going to be lean. So focus on those things and then slowly add in some of the condition. That's the way to do it. I want to take a break when we come back. I want to talk about something that you've been doing.

That's probably way Beneath The Horizon for a lot of people they may not know it but you have a very elite group of people that belong to a kind of special club that you started and get together. Now, you don't advertise this, but I want to talk about it because there may be people out there who want to know more about your seminars in your and you're in your I guess do comb boot camps not what do you.

I'll be called the Renegade experience. It's just a three-day kind of own one mind-body-spirit adventure for men. I want to talk about that when we come back from the break. How's that sound? You can reach out to [01:15:00] Jason for Gia if you like what he's saying or you want to talk to him more about? Any of the services he offers his website is http://jasonferruggia.com  .

 We'll be right back with more super human radio. Welcome back. We're talking with Jason for Gia for Jason talk about these how long have the Renegade get-togethers been going on for about four years now? Yeah around there. How did it come about? So before I buy a new I've been out in Cali about eight years now from Jersey and the final couple of years in Jersey.

I was wanting weekend Fitness seminars where we would you know, go through basic training exercises and Concepts and mobility and whatnot. And then when I got out here was the first time in years that I didn't have my own gym. And so I kind of started to miss it and I said, I want to get back into doing events again, but because I've been on a journey of personal development and growth.

For the end of the [01:16:00] previous few years. I said, I want incorporate think it can really make a huge difference in my life. So incorporate this into the fitness events as well. So it took a while and over the course of the four years of the continually got tweaked and changed but it's really a it's for a small group of manager tribal Gathering which doesn't happen enough anymore.

And we all get together we train we do, you know various different kinds of workouts Outside Inside strength training Mobility. Breathwork recovery stop hiking water sports and we have talks and guest speakers on mindset and personal development at habits and overcoming can you know insecurities and improving your communication skills with all the things to kind of, you know, make a modern man and help you Unleash Your strongest self and you developing the guys developing incredibly.

Close friendships and lifelong bonds with each other. So it's been really rewarding. It's been one of the best things I've ever done in my career. So we do about six or so of those a year [01:17:00] and then I have a group of guys who get into kind of a coaching and mentorship program would be a mastermind kind of program.

We also meet up another three times and who locations like Miami and Seattle Moab and things like that. I love those Destination type of events to because you know, you everybody goes on vacation. And they get hammered, you know what I mean, you know yet they drink way more than they're supposed to they eat Foods.

They're not supposed to and I've always thought of you know, it's so cool to go on vacation be in the sun. Like I'm a huge. You know me. I mean we talked about I was there like I love the sun. I like laying in the sun. I mean, I don't buy into the whole Sun equals cancer thing and. But to go to a destination and instead of getting hammered and eating the wrong Foods actually elevating, you know, elevating your mind elevating your body elevating your spirit talk about the spirit side of this.

I mean, this is [01:18:00] so that you know, a lot of people stay away from that because all of a sudden gets a little touchy-feely how do guys like that do they like they like the internet? Yeah. So my buddy who I've known forever. But he studied Native American culture for years even as a kid he was he was meditating was reading for role since he's been 12 years old.

He's been obsessed with it. So he helps me out at my events and those some of the coaching as well. And you know, the reality is like you said come guys come in with the kind of a hard wall or shell up, but we created, you know, we kind of Master now for doing it for four years. We've kind of created this environment.

Where everybody feel safe and want to open up and we get men saying things the last two events. We've had guys say things that they've never said to anybody else and their 40 plus years on the planet and you know, we get some guys breaking down sometimes and [01:19:00] you have all these breakthroughs and it's great and we've always been thanked by everybody just saying, you know, I've never really felt.

It's comfortable enough as I do to be able to share this stuff. So I think that missing from Men's lives. It's dearest old stereotype for us to just hold everything inside and just be tough and put up a wall, but it's pretty rewarding to be to be able to do that. And then to see that happen. I want to explore that a little further for a second because recently I put up on Facebook a post about Greco Roman times and how we.

Cherished strengths in humans. We revered strong humans and that was probably because strong humans were robust. They were resistant to disease they lived longer and hence the adage Only the Strong Survive really evolved from that. That's it was true for thousands of years. And as a result people knew all the strong people tend to survive.

And so in today's day and age we have these terms like toxic masculinity and you know [01:20:00] men of the reason for war and testosterone is evil and anything perceived as masculine today is really bad. And so I posted this the other day and I had a picture at a picture of a statue. Originally done in 300 BC of Hercules and he look like any Olympia competitor today, right?

And so, you know, he really looked like that right because they didn't make him look he wasn't puny and they met they sculpted his body and he looked like any anybody that we look to today that trains hard like wow, and that's what he looked like back then you're 300 BC and so. I said yoga called.

He didn't look like that. How would they even Envision? Yes. Yes Oprah, like exactly that's exactly my point. And so and so I said, you know, there was a time where we appreciated strengthen today. We don't it was a lot longer posting that and someone came out and said that I was wrong. Because you know men have to be sensitive to and I didn't even respond because [01:21:00] I had no time but I don't understand why masculinity is positioned as being juxtaposed against sensitivity men have always been sent.

Men have always been masculine. They are mutually exclusive and they both occur at the same time in men. So part of the misconception today, is that a masculine guy is just a brute and he's a he's a thug and he's insensitive, but I have a funny feeling and I'm speaking from personal experience to the web stronger a man feels the more readily he is to be sensitive.

A hundred percent. I mean, you know being vulnerable is a strength that everybody has in 20 some people think vulnerability is a weakness. I think it's a strength to show that You're vulnerable. I mean, you know, every superhero has a vulnerability. There's no story. There's no likability.

Superman's got Kryptonite. Everybody has something. You know nobody's perfect and to your point some of the strongest toughest guys, I know are also the most emotional so they might be the most intense in the gym or you know on the field [01:22:00] or wherever but they're also the first guy to cry at a funeral or to cry when sports legend retires or something like that or you know, something tragic happens there.

They're super emotional. I mean I can cry at the sight of dogs because I love dogs and rescue so much and things like that. There's no shame in that now and you know, but I'm still all about, you know, being a man and everything that that finds a man since the dawn of time since Hercules. Like you said, I think anyone who is kind of cuckooing that toxic masculinity and that has no idea how the world works because it never all to go away the world of just cease to exist as the way we know it pretty well there would be you know, there would be no more.

Well, I mean you could take this down, right? And the reality is the same way femininity is not toxic masculinity is not toxic and the stronger the man the more readily I find he is able to be sensitive and [01:23:00] you know, you said something and I'm going to say something and you're going to relate to it, but when we grew up and where we grew up.

There was a term like somebody would say, well he took kindness for weakness, right you've heard anything. Yeah, and that's because when you grow up in a rough environment, if you're a kind person people think that you're stupid you're easy to get over and they can they can get over on you.

That doesn't mean there aren't opportunity to be sensitive because once you have close friends that you know that you can trust them you can be sensitive with them. So this notion that masculinity is the opposite of sensitivity is nonsense the most this more masculine man. The stronger he is the more confident he is the faster you will find that he's sensitive and loving and you because he you can't hurt him.

You can't he'll cry in front of you. I mean, I cry regularly have movies and stuff like that. And I'm not embarrassed about it [01:24:00] because I'm yeah, I'm the polar opposite when it comes to being strong as I am, right, you know, I can go both ways in a flip of a switch and be strong and both of them.

So you're right. You're absolutely right. You know, I had a friend one time who was kind of struggling and business and what not and he said he said I don't understand how you're able to be ruthless like that and kind of have that don't give a crap outta to deny. Well, do you think that I mean do you think that if you surveyed any of my friends they would think I'm a jerk or saying anything.

I got to be said no, not at all. Everybody loves you. And if you're a super nice person and as a yes, but I also have that line that people know not to cross people know not to disrespect people know not to waste my time. People not know not to say certain things around me and that's all in the way.

You carry yourself. That's all in [01:25:00] the way. You speak the way you respond or don't respond to certain things. You can be the nicest guy in the world and either be strong or be we can let people take advantage of you. So being nice doesn't necessarily mean you your week you could be strong and take charge and dominate and you know, not take any crap, but also be a really nice kind sensitive guy.

I think that's what people get it twisted. Sometimes they think you can't be both you certainly can. And you have to be if you want to be, you know, a leader and be successful and be happy because a lot of people who try to be nice all the time or quality was quite nice and quotes there on happy and they care too much about what people think about them their people Pleasers.

So you try to be nice and you take care of everybody. You're not taking care of yourself and deep down inside or in the quiet of your own home. You're really angry and resentful and to those [01:26:00] people I recommend they read a book called No More mr. Nice guy. Which is great if you're struggling with that kind of thing because you know, you want to be nice sure.

Of course, we need that but you don't want to take crap either and become the doormat for other people. You know, I actually listen to that book on Audible and it's amazing. Okay. Have you have you found have you are you familiar with blankest? Yes. Yeah, you know I haven't signed up for yet, but somebody because I like to read so much everything.

Someone's telling me I got to get on that. So is there a new sponsor the show and blankest.com forward slash super human will give you a seven day free trial. I love to read. But I don't always have time to read so I started using inaudible but you still have to you listen have to listen for the around the same amount of time as you have to read the book.

It's not like I listen to audible at one and a [01:27:00] half times the speed but you still have to make a major commitment to listening and instead of reading. Blink is This brilliant? They read the book. They pick the most important things about the book. They reduce them to what they call blinks and in 15 minutes.

You can absorb everything that you need to know about a book without having to read it. All I mean blink is that come forward slash super human 7-Day free trial. It's I think it's like $40 a year. It's the best investment I've ever made because when I meant when I'm at the gym doing cardio I can I can literally learn the.

The three books in a session I can listen in my car. I listen before bed. It's like now. Because you always hear these things about the most successful people read four books a week. Hell with blankets I can do for books a day. So stand back. No, it's really cool. You got to check it out before my audience.

We got a special deal blankest.com forward slash super human, and I'm telling you [01:28:00] just make sure you buy bigger hats because your brain is going to grow and so is your head we're going to take a less commercial break Jason. I want to ask you some real quick questions get simple answers like your favorite workouts and all that sort of stuff stay tuned.

We'll be right.

Welcome back. We're wrapping up. The interview with Jason Ferruggia his website http://jasonferruggia.com  reach out to him. Let him know you heard about him on supremum radio. Who knows maybe you'll get invited to one of these Renegade events someday. Okay. This is like a real quick couple questions that I like to ask people.

The first one is if you could only do one movement for the rest of your life, what would it be? Dumbbell cleaning process because it works pretty much everything. Okay worst machine in the gym to ever use. That's a tough one. I think about the ones that hurts people the most in your experience your experience.

So many I'm not a fan of the Smith machine at [01:29:00] all. You know, I can't believe so many people say the Smith machine. It's just mind-boggling and every Jim's got to you know what I mean? Yeah. Yeah. Okay best. What are yours for the for the worst machine? I think the I think the. The lateral fly machine, but the one that you stand in front of a new grab the pegs that stick out.

So it's you know, it's a you're holding it. I like the lateral fly machine that you put your elbows up against and you hold onto the handles. Okay, but the one way your arms are straight out. I personally have dislocated her shoulder on that one. And I know a couple people that have as well. Yeah, and really my favorite machine in the gym would probably be the would probably be the power squat machine.

I love the way that feels. Yeah, there's a few different companies who make good one. I also love a good belt squat. Yes, and then of [01:30:00] course, that was my next question. What is your do you have a favorite machine, but you just said it.

There you go. Yeah, probably a good belt squat. I'm trying to think who made a really good. One that I think John Perillo or someone maybe I'm going back in the day. There was still at least I make some he still has it. Yeah hip they call it the hip squat the hip Squad, right? Right, right. Yeah.

Those are great the pitch Arts great. I love those. Hey, do you ever do any inversion? I have an inversion table at home and I get up. I know every single night before bed. It's the you know, I got to tell you something just like if you and I were just sitting across the table. It's the greatest investment that any of us could make who enter resistance training.

I'll tell you why everything we do loads the spine from head down very rarely. Do we stretch the spine back out again? Right, totally, you know me personally and so many people [01:31:00] I know have you know, L4 L5 S1 compressions from Decades of squatting and deadlifting and you know, and sure you can go to the chiropractor and get adjustments to Every Soul.

But the greatest thing in the world is after you've trained all day, you know early in the morning and you've been sitting on your ass at work and you get on you get in that thing and hang from your ankles completely upside down and I can literally. Jason feel the vertebrae pop pop pop  pop and now I've gotten so good at it that I relax my abs and I can feel my lumbar spine stretching like almost like I look like I'm doing it upside down vacuum pose that my abs just going to stretch out and I feel that one that L4 L5.

I can feel it goes and it just opens up and I can actually run up the stairs pain free. That's how effective it is. I wish more people you can go to Play It Again Sports and buy a used [01:32:00] one for like $65 best investment that any of us who lift heavy weights, especially overhead could ever make to keep our spine protected.

Really? Okay, I gotta try it. Yeah, Hey. Listen, man. I want to thank you so much for being on the air today with. Well, thank you. I appreciate it. I think we covered a lot of interesting stuff. I think people are going to tell me that this was really a great show because we did Traverse a lot of great information today.

Oh glad to hear it. And because my Italian last name is Cooper hard day spelling remember if you go to ja why dot fit that will send you to my website as well. http://jay.fit . I got to get one of those man, right? I look man. See you next time. I'm out. I'm out in LA and let me know when the podcast drops that we did the interview with.

Okay? Yeah Sharon. Well, thanks so much for take care of Jason.

So there you have [01:33:00] it another great show, h tomorrow. I don't know if I have a show tomorrow, believe it or not. I got to look I think I do. But I forget anyway, I want to thank dr. Jeff Golini. Of course check out All-American Pharmaceuticals if exports get six of their top-selling products absolutely free by going to supremum radio dotnet and clicking the EFX Sports Banner ad you'll pay five dollars and change it but you'll get a ton of goodies.

You'll be really appreciative of it. And that's so you can try them before you buy them and we'll see everybody if not tomorrow. Monday with more super human radio. Thank you for listening today.