[00:00:00] You know, I've been waiting a long time to do this show. And the reason for that is there's not a lot of people that I can talk about this topic about iron accumulation in the body. You know, those of you have been following the show for the past. We're in our 14th year. Now know that I've talked about iron periodically as a potential cause for illness dating back probably about.

[00:00:59] And [00:01:00] eight years ago when I had Dr. Michael Smith from Life Extension foundation on the show, and we talked about a study that showed that many of the conditions associated with iron overload caught up to women once they went through menopause because they weren't menstruating. They weren't bleeding.

[00:01:19] They were accumulating iron at the similar rates as men and there are even studies out there that many years ago presumed that many of. The heart conditions associated with men exclusively that women don't get had to do with iron accumulation. But you know iron isn't sexy. It's not sexy like stem cells, you know, it's not sexy like genetics, you know, my opinion of genetics, right?

[00:01:47] I mean geneticists will take a guy who is drowning and say oh if we could find the gene that allows him to breathe water. No, no just don't breathe on the water and you don't drown you don't have to change them genetically. [00:02:00] So I have been trying to get somebody on the show to talk about iron for a long time.

[00:02:04] But it's a really a an area that no one really wants to get into anymore and it's really sad until I met my guest today and that's morally Robbins. How you doing morally doing great. Let me let me bring on camera here. For some reason. There we go. There we go. Yeah, I'm the cameraman. I'm.

[00:02:27] Producer there really isn't any way. How's the music by the way, that was a great great intro & music. Oh, yes. I've been using so you should when I first started doing the show in 2005. I actually took the original Superman intro shed everywhere where it said Superman. I just voiced over Carlin or and it was really Camry and it was very funny.

[00:02:50] It was very funny. And that's occasionally. I dig it out and use it here and there but it's great. So. I think [00:03:00] that I would imagine.  Excuse me. A lot of people think iron accumulation of iron overload.  Isn't that big of a deal because otherwise your doctor would talk to you about it? Right? Right.

[00:03:13] Sure. So does it does it even exist or we are we creating fake news here today? Yes, I'm here from the Department of Justice and I don't going to tell you the full truth. Yeah, exactly.  No, it's very tragic that it is absolutely the source and I thought I know we've had this conversation to be careful about hyperbole.

[00:03:43] But we live on an we live on a planet that is 36 percent iron that I would like to say. Wow. Let's that's at the core image at the surface, you know irons with the crust. It's the second most important element metal and it's the fourth element and I'm like, [00:04:00] it doesn't matter. We have the energy of iron on this planet and we have a sea of people.

[00:04:07] Who are anemic it makes no sense at all. And the way I characterize that is so then the most evolved species on the planet can't live with the most important element on the planet, which is iron that that makes no sense at all. So the way I characterize it is that there really are only two reasons.

[00:04:28] Why live women outlive men only really two reasons one. They're smart. And they have a monthly blood loss just as you were alluding to and that monthly blood loss lowers their exposure to iron throughout their menstrual years and then as soon as they stop menstruating boom, Start to accumulate with a guy who figured this out.

[00:04:56] His name was Jerry Sullivan. He was actually a med student at [00:05:00] the University of Florida in Gainesville in the 1970s. It was like they were studying Cardiology and the six differences in the rate of heart disease, and he was like trying to figure it out and.  His very first article he wanted to become a pathologist and he was developing what then became known as the iron.

[00:05:21] Hurt hypothesis and is very first article was in 1983 and Lancet, so that would be like first time at bat in Yankee Stadium hitting their grand slam. I mean talk about an impressive way to start your career and.  He laid out this theory that is highly controversial in the field of Cardiology. Why because it eviscerates all the insanity of cardiologists and.

[00:05:51] Excursions and it turns out that the heart muscle is really toxic around the presence of too much iron [00:06:00] and Jerry Sullivan was able to prove it and it's the world's never been the same since and so Ron Penna who was also fascinated by Iron he and I have talked about this said to me once that.

[00:06:13] Chlorophyll and blood are exactly exactly the same except that at the core of blood is iron at the core of chlorophyll is zinc. Is that correct? The core of chlorophyll is magnesium. I always get the right every time I say that he goes no no with magnesium. Yes, it's magnesium. Other than that blood and chlorophyll a pretty much the same.

[00:06:33] Isn't that correct? Very very similar. Absolutely. Yeah, and the other the other one would be the Crustaceans have. Blood and what's different they have Copper at the center? There's the blue absolutely fascinating. Yeah. Absolutely. Yes. And so the thing is we live in a very we live in a club Planet it has iron we live in a very iron Centric society [00:07:00] and we have a very iron Centric diet and we think that iron is really important.

[00:07:04] Well, it's like let's let's step back from this a little bit and start to tease apart. What's really going on? So that 80% of the iron in our body is tied up in What's called the erythro on which is the birthing and the movement and the recycling of red blood cells, right 80% of the eye. That's a lot of iron before we I want to go down that path and I also want to talk about you know, you know, one of the things that's fascinating me that you have taught me already is I kept thinking from an evolutionary standpoint.

[00:07:42] How could this abundant mineral? Be bad for us. How did the body cope with it? We're going to talk about that a little bit later that there really is a system in place to keep you from developing iron overload. So you don't have to always donate blood but before we get [00:08:00] into that the thing that fascinated me the most about iron was that when I started to look at the symptoms of iron overload.

[00:08:09] I saw the entire sick aging phenotype of our population when we think of Aging we think of. Stiffness, we think of joint pain, we think of diminishing cartilage and discs we think of here nervous system hair loss. We think of nervous system degradation. We think of the gut issues, you know, the gut becomes less functional malabsorption and all of those individually could be correlated back to iron can't.

[00:08:38] Absolutely. Yeah, I love the way I characterize it is our liver turns into a ferris wheel.  and I spelled the word ferrous differently at the Rous and all of the symptoms of Aging are sitting in the. And the practitioners are trained to treat the seats [00:09:00] and ignore the broken axle of copper iron dysregulation.

[00:09:04] That's that in a nutshell. That's the whole that's the whole ship. That's right there, you know, we can hang up right now and just just go home now. We really can't but I know you're being facetious. Absolutely. Yeah, but no but this show so we have become fascinated. With the gut microbiome 76% of Americans claimed to have digestive issues iron actually messes up the gut doesn't it absolutely does.

[00:09:32] Yeah without question. It's but again the the cells in our gut are called in Tarot. And they look like my two hands together, right? These are the Villi the fingers of the Villi. Right? Well, what keeps those cells together, it's called Energy you get it. You got to have ATP to keep these cells together and when there's too much iron in the cells iron starts to accumulate inside the cells.

[00:10:00] [00:10:00] It destroys the ability of the cell to make ATP and they start to fall apart. That's when the protein start to come through between the entero sites and that's what creates the toxic response inside the gut. It's not complicated. And then the other problem is why is the iron Building inside the cell whereas a little doorway down here?

[00:10:23] It all into our sites. And what is the terrorists that mean enter? Oh site site is sell its where the food enters the body and this little doorway. It's called Pharaoh Porton Pharaoh for iron portent for doorway. It's a doorway for iron to get out and and who's the doorman at the at the door? His file available copper and just called it's an enzyme called Pharaoh oxidase.

[00:10:51] That's not apparently allowed to be it's like it's like we're back at Hogwarts. We're not allowed to say Voldemort. We're not allowed to say Pharaoh oxidase. [00:11:00] And that's the that's the very enzyme that allows for iron circulation to take place in our body. Okay. So the one of the interesting telltale signs of iron overload is something.

[00:11:14] Experienced then that was that that's when the light bulb went off in my head.  So I was suffering from unusual levels of muscle fatigue in my legs like just walking up the stairs. I started to develop lactate, you know GI. Well, I'm thinking what is this but the real issue was in the middle of the night.

[00:11:39] I would wake up and my muscles I felt like I had been jogging for an hour they were. Or soreness and I thought what is this? And that is the one that is actually a Hallmark that you can differentiate between other things like like like there are people who suffer from lactic acidosis that a diabetic the way you can tell this is not like the guests don't believe that you're laying there [00:12:00] sleeping and you have this burning in your muscles.

[00:12:04] What is that from? What why am I feeling that if it's not lactic acid is this from hyper oxidation because iron is the most oxidative of. In our world, right? Absolutely and what you're feeling is inflammation. The inflammatory response is what it's really doing of the cell the cell inside the mitochondria of the cell.

[00:12:28] What we're doing is we're activating oxygen and turning it into water.  So that it can release the precursor energy molecules called ADP and they go over to complex 5 and get turned into. Magnesium ATP and if magnesium is not there. It's not going to get recognized but back at complex for and it's a two-stroke engine.

[00:12:55] And and if that two-stroke engine doesn't work properly. [00:13:00] It's going to produce H2O2 which is hydrogen peroxide. It's not going to make two molecules of H2O and that H2O2 is if it's a signaling molecule at at low doses but it's a source of information at high doses and what most people don't seem to understand is that a buildup of iron is directly correlational with inflammation?

[00:13:28] It's the very. It's a very mechanism for information. It's a very mechanism for inflammatory cytokines. And and so Aubrey de grey was on my show many many years ago. And you know who he is. He's the guy who postulated the the mitochondrial Theory of Aging and and his opposition to exercise was that you're creating a lot more free radicals by exercising so don't exercise which is it isn't true.

[00:13:52] But that's what he thinks but now we come full circle to talk about. And what you're basically saying is that iron is [00:14:00] the reason that we're developing a lot of full right of free radicals when the mitochondria is doing its normal job. Not my idea. This is dr. Harmon who he was actually an electrical engineer and in the 1950s he decided to go back and get a degree in medicine at Stanford.

[00:14:18] So the guy was obviously very talented, but in 1954. He wrote a very important article about the free radical Theory of Aging what again highly controversial. But but again, you know as well as I do that these that I love the picture of the other Rusty Truck That's a classic but that's the first time I've ever used an inanimate object as a picture for a show by the way.

[00:14:44] Yeah, that's a superhuman truck. Right? And so the thing is 3 radical Theory of Aging is clearly. Predicated on the fact that every day were on this planet. We're adding iron to our frame. This is this is not [00:15:00] rocket science. And that's not my idea. That's the that's the compelling research of Robert Krypton and gotta reach and hollawell these these luminary iron researchers on the planet are like don't you guys get it they were a branding iron every day.

[00:15:15] And so. The thing is it's not just adding iron. It's being able to recycle the iron very very important function, which I'm sure we'll talk about and the one of the most important properties of the human body is there is no hormonal regulation of iron status. That means that there's no way to to there's no negative feedback loop to say.

[00:15:40] Oh, we've got enough stop taking it in exactly. And so the only way to get rid of excess iron, there's only one way to do it. Let's go donate some blood right? It's the thing is, you know how our ancestors. Worked in the field and they sweated their buns off and you do release iron, but it's very [00:16:00] very small amounts what I think there would be absolutely what I think we're missing today as a component which is a byproduct of activity and work labor.

[00:16:08] Is that every time you break a red blood cell the spleen gets it out along with the iron contained. And and so doesn't get it out. It holds onto it. So what's the difference between f 2 and F 3 Fe 2 and Fe 3 what's the difference between those forms of iron? Okay, so I'm going to answer that question.

[00:16:31] Let me just clarify what the working in the field do working in the field exposed you to sunlight and everyone's everyone's obsessed with sunlight for vitamin D because that's what stimulates the synthesis of vitamin D. But what everyone overlooked? Is the fact that sunlight activates the breakdown of vitamin A retinol into its component parts and retinol is absolutely essential for regulating iron now [00:17:00] back to your question.

[00:17:01] What's the difference between Fe 2 and Fe 3 Fe 2 is ferrous iron. It's a very toxic form of iron and Fe 3 and that that ferrous iron is the waiter carrying all that oxygen. Blood cells. Okay. It's a very important function but it's a waiter. It's a waiter and when we go to a restaurant are we excited about the waiter or the chef whose activating the food and turning it into an experience?

[00:17:30] Well, who's the chef in the mitochondria? It's copper complex for it is it's the Benihana Chef slicing and dicing oxygen. To turn it into water. That's that's what copper does. So the Fe 2 carries oxygen and it gets involved in like iron-sulfur clusters and things like that, which is very important but fe3 is ferric iron and it gets [00:18:00] bound principally to two very important proteins one is transferrin.

[00:18:08] very very. Transport protein for iron and the other is ferritin which is a storage protein and what people don't realize is that if 80% of our ion is tied up in the red blood cells less than 10% is tied up in. It's important for people to understand is that from 1860 to 1972 doctors and any health practitioner measured your iron status by measuring hemoglobin.

[00:18:43] Because it's in transport. It's a movement all over the body. It's very much involved in the recycling program. And and it's where the dominant amount of iron is and then in 1972 Jacobs at all published a very [00:19:00] important article in the British Journal of Medicine about ferret. And the world's never been the same since they only look at ferritin now.

[00:19:09] Yeah, they took the spotlight. They moved it away from hemoglobin and put it onto ferritin and the tragedy is people don't understand how distorted and misrepresentative ferritin is about iron homeostasis because iron was never meant to be stored that Jerry Sullivan said there is no. Physiological function for ferritin it is purely a storage locker for excess iron.

[00:19:44] So theoretically and and his assistant his assertion was that in the ideal situation? All Iron would be stored and you wouldn't have a need for ferritin because it would either be in the red blood cells are in the tissue and that's it. Exactly and [00:20:00] and we need a very modest amount to be in storage.

[00:20:04] But the all of that has been lost because of this obsession with trying to get more and more ferritin and when I began to really study this Carl was when my clients were telling me they had to get their fair to the up to a hundred for their thyroid meds to work. I went what what what what is the role of ferritin and thyroid I have no idea that that is the most.

[00:20:27] Same thing. It's like it's like well, let's fill our car up with gasoline the backseat. So we make sure we have enough to make new trip to the command make the trip is like no you don't do that. And and this idea that that somehow again what I had the had the honor of talking to Douglas Kell who is one of the world's Authorities on iron.

[00:20:51] He's a distinguished professor at the University of Manchester. And he wrote a very important article in in 2009 entitled [00:21:00] iron behaving badly and I would encourage your listeners to track down that article. It's not it's not a quick read of I will warn you but when a scientist wants to make a statement they will have about a hundred and fifty to two hundred footnotes that has real Vigor and it's very rigorous rigorous rigorous.

[00:21:24] Short right exactly his study in 2009 has over 2,400 citations. So what it was it was a an in-your-face moment for the scientific and clinical community that you're not just wrong about ferritin you're dead wrong. Right? And when I spoke to him about a year ago, I asked him point-blank. I said Doctor kill what is the ideal ferrets and level for human?

[00:21:53] He said zero in my eyes, you know got as big as based. How could that [00:22:00] be? Right? He said morally I want to make sure you understand this. He said ferritin is not synthesized in the blood.  It is secreted into the blood and it is secreted by organ pathophysiology. What that means translation if you have too much iron, it's going to cause oxidative stress rust back to your pickup truck in the right in the beginning.

[00:22:31] And in that process is going to cause inflammation for as my clients down here in Louisiana court information. I can cause inflammation and that is going to trigger the release of Farah to bind it up to protect the body from. But here's the kicker. This is why doctor Kel was distinguished because he was able to prove that as that ferritin [00:23:00] molecule is leaving the organ tissue.

[00:23:03] It's breaking apart and the iron is releasing into the tissue. And what we're measuring in the blood test is a protein called ferritin and we're assuming that it's got all this wonderful iron inside it. No, it doesn't right because fight because vitamin high dose vitamin like ridiculously high dose vitamin C 10 grams a day has been shown to cause the body to make ferritin in the absence of additional iron intake so that means that.

[00:23:33] The body can make ferritin regardless of whether it's there's iron there for it to carry or not. So looking at ferritin really isn't in fact, and I'm sure you're going to tell me even a better way. But now what I do is I my doctor orders ferritin, but I also do a TI BC which is direct iron and look at that as an assessment of what I've.

[00:23:56] I would really like to know I really like to get a punch biopsy done to tell you the [00:24:00] truth. Well, yeah, I would too. It's a little it's painful where you could get a T2 MRI, but that's very expensive. But what I do, but I've developed it's just taking existing blood work or blood panels. I've created what I call the full monty iron pan.

[00:24:18] It has 12 different parameters and I do pick up the ferritin. I do pick up the ti B CI pick up the full iron. Look at serum iron. I look at transferrin. I look at percent saturation, but I'm also looking at what's the magnesium level inside the red blood cell? I'm looking at what's the zinc and copper level?

[00:24:38] I'm looking at what's the cerullo plasma level which is a very important. Yeah, we're going to talk about through the plasma but Excel. Yeah, I look at hemoglobin and. I've added to it vitamin A and vitamin D because they're very important in the regulation of iron. So getting back [00:25:00] to jumping around.

[00:25:01] I remember talking about a study on my show many years ago that showed that copper deficiency actually leads to fibrotic tissue development in the heart and cardiomyopathy and they did a couple good rodent. Parties where they did the aortic clamp to create back pressure and and but they gave one group of rodents and they infused them with copper.

[00:25:30] I don't know chelated copper something like that and they did not when they sacrifice them to look at the heart. They did not develop the fibrotic tissue. So there must be a linkage between fibrotic tissue and iron in the heart. Maybe that's causing this fibrotic tissue to form. Absolutely. There's the yours a unique quality of iron.

[00:25:52] That's because to it did something, you know, again, we can't live without it. We can't live without iron, but we need to manage it [00:26:00] and there's only one mineral that manages it. It's called copper. It's so it's so clear in the literature, but yet it's not taught anywhere certainly not only on the internet, but.

[00:26:12] Iron, has the ability to activate a key enzyme in the bone matrix called acid phosphatase and that's the enzyme that allows the Osteo class the the bone cells that break down the tissue right that acid phosphatase brings them to life and causes calcium release. So iron causes calcium loss. From hard tissue and trusting and and then it has the unique ability by a series of enzymes that it activates it triggers what's called endoplasmic reticulum stress.

[00:26:53] It's also called ER stress. Right what happens under ER stress? There's this massive release of calcium. [00:27:00] It also activates mCP one and tgf-beta. Well those those last two enzymes are the very mechanisms. Of making fibrosis and calcification trusting and iron activates all of those enzymes to cause calcium buildup in the soft tissue.

[00:27:23] It's an amazing mineral, you know, you know and really enjoying it any time you mess with the the endoplasmic reticulum what you also run the risk of doing this. So the ER is kind of like the telegraph office of every cell it assembles amino acids and specific sequences to send messages between cells.

[00:27:40] And absolutely and and so you're not only you're probably also creating a lot of bad messages that end up becoming aggregate or plaque or they just get they have no home or they're telling the cells the wrong thing. So messing with the ER probably has a variety of systemic effects as well huge. So [00:28:00] let's put it in perspective for people.

[00:28:04] this planet.  for billions of years lived very happily. With life-forms living on iron was very very successful and then about two and a half billion years ago and I have no idea how the astrophysicist figure this out, but they did but about two and a half billion years ago the phytoplankton started producing oxygen and when they started producing oxygen something very powerful.

[00:28:37] 99% of life forms on this planet died.  because when you mix oxygen and iron we get the truck that was at the beginning of the show, right? Right, so we know that and so then the planet had a crisis when it's here. Well two different authors Robert Krypton who I referred [00:29:00] to earlier. He's the dean of metal biology on the planet.

[00:29:03] He's up in the Netherlands guy's a genius and a Dr. Kaplan wrote two separate articles about why we are allowed to exist on this planet is there's only one reason why because we were able to recruit copper. To activate the oxygen and turn it into water so that we could respire and release energy and so copper has the unique ability to activate oxygen and turn it into water.

[00:29:37] And it goes on to deactivate what are called oxidants. What does that that's accidents with oxygen are called oxidants hydrogen one instant and so copper enzymes like superoxide dismutase catalase glutathione peroxidase peroxidase. I mean, I could go on for an [00:30:00] hour naming the enzymes that copper activates in order to deactivate the oxygen so it.

[00:30:06] Come free radicals.  And so there's this elegant relationship between copper and iron and it goes back to the very origin of oxygen on this planet again, there are classes of scientists who know this intimately but none of this truth is taught in any kind of practitioner school that I'm aware of, you know, and again, so I have this hole.

[00:30:35] Um disdain for the whole genetic approach to managing diseases because a geneticist if I approached her house and there was no door on the front and I had to walk around to the side to get into your house. I would just say, oh I have to walk up the geneticist wants to put a door in the front. Well, you know, I mean, it's sometimes it's you just have to cope with what you've got [00:31:00] instead of trying to redesign the organism to accept what you don't want and and.

[00:31:05] What's up? I was just going to the way I characterize it as we're in the kitchen. We've got a blender a hair dryer in a TV on the same Sokka, what's going to happen? The circuit is going to blow. Right? Right. So if you talk to an electrician, they'll tell you to go downstairs and flip the switch.

[00:31:22] But if you talk to a geneticist, they'll tell you to rewire the whole house. Right? Right. Yeah, that's a good team. So so so so so and the reason I say this is because what I said earlier in the show is true, you know Iron just. Sexy thing it's not so it's so old. It's Antiquated. It's rust. It's like we don't really need to worry about that with further up the road where much more advanced even worry about iron.

[00:31:45] But the reality is that if people started paying attention to their iron intake and making sure that the things are in place to manage iron, which we're going to take a break now and when we come back I'm going to talk about the not the the existing [00:32:00] systems that are in place that are dead are that our evolutionary gifts to us?

[00:32:05] We are not taking advantage of that actually will help us manage iron. Okay, so we're going to take one quick commercial break when we battle come back. We'll be talking more about the stay tuned. We'll be right back. Welcome back morally what morally what is your website? You have a website, don't you?

[00:32:23] Yeah.  R CP 1 2 3 dot o-- r-- g-- there are CP stands for root cause protocol RCP 1 2 3. Gotta Wear G and they can download the manual and I love the name of it because unlike allopathic medicine that treats symptoms. What you're looking at doing is showing people a way to eliminate the symptoms by treating the actual cause the actual problem.

[00:32:50] So and also we have a comment from a live listener here. I want to put up Darcy Clark says another brilliant show Carlin or very important and valuable information. Thank you for being here. Thank you [00:33:00] for commenting and anybody's comment that you can ask questions they'll appear. On the screen also, so thank you for that.

[00:33:07] So obviously Evolution endowed us with a way to manage iron didn't it? I mean aside from sunlight which I you know, I'm with you on son. I'm a huge proponent of activating the Milano court and system. There's a mat amazing things that go far beyond vitamin D synthesis. And as you point out, you know sunlight has a role in vitamin D status.

[00:33:30] I mean in Iron status and management, but what is the role of things like copper magnesium and and and also a ceruloplasmin in helping people manage the iron and not get to that point of overload that we are lacking. We're missing out on today, right?

[00:33:50] What are things people need to understand is that the number one nutrient deficiency on the farm?  [00:34:00] is copper deficiency.  Why do you say the multi-purpose? What do you what do you say the farm? You mean and the the stuff we're growing on the phone. You are absolutely any form of a firm's that there's been a an 80% loss of copper in the soil around the world over the last hundred years.

[00:34:19] That's a very serious problem. But let me put it into context for people if we take we have we have on average twenty five trillion red blood cells in our. That's a lot of red blood cells. So if we take the surface area of all of those 25 Chilean red blood cells, it's the equivalent of a football field of surface area.

[00:34:44] So basically we got a football field of iron inside our body and that represents 5,000 milligrams of iron which is an enormous amount of iron in our blood. Now what regulates that 5,000 milligrams [00:35:00] of iron is one penny that's 90 milligrams of copper.  So imagine putting that penny in the corner of a football field and expecting that little Penny to cover and regulate the the field the Gridiron as we call it right Frank wink the greater and that's exactly what's going on inside our body.

[00:35:21] What has happened. Carl is over the last say. He 70 years is they've turned that penny.  Of copper into a BB I do you got to say baby. Yeah, right. It's like it's a fraction of what it used to be and it's not enough. And so what we have is we live in a society where they are adding iron. They're adding vitamin D and adding sugar all three of those elements are related iron sugar and.

[00:35:55] They have a relationship with each other and then we have three other. [00:36:00] Could you explain could you explain the relationship before we move on let me finish this I'll come now cake. Okay, so then so then the the corollary has copper and fat and vitamin A have a relationship. Hey, guess what we do as a society.

[00:36:19] We demonize all three of those. People are afraid to take retinol. Now. That's the real form of vitamin A copper is not in the soil the way it used to be. Right and most of your listeners are eating a low fat diet. Why because their parents and Grandparents were afraid of heart disease because they believe the BS of ancel keys and all the cardiologists that believed him and we now know that that was all a scam but it took 65 years to figure that out.

[00:36:51] And so we have this massive disproportion between we've got copper and fat and vitamin A down here [00:37:00] and iron and vitamin D and sugar up here in the body is not designed for that. And in fact, I'll tell you something interesting. So I stopped taking my retinyl palmitate because you said that synthetic just use cod liver oil and I have I have the metagenic cod liver oil at home, which is very very good and I am taking a full.

[00:37:19] Una de to replace the 10,000 units of retinol palmitate I'm now taking 10,000 units of vitamin A from from a cod liver oil and I met you I mean I have I have liverwurst today with my lunch. I hate liver three or four times a week. I saw I started looking at liver because I thought wow this is really interesting, you know cod liver oil has way way more vitamin A than vitamin D and as I started to look at liver.

[00:37:47] Calves liver, there is a disproportionate amount of vitamin A to vitamin D and I'm thinking wow, we're so fixated on vitamin D when the body seems to think vitamin A is much more important that it takes [00:38:00] up more real estate in the liver to store it absolutely does and here's some interesting facts the first recorded cure for anemia that I've been able to find.

[00:38:12] Is from 1855 from a London physician named Theophilus Thompson, and he used cod liver oil to cure the anemia of his patients in London at the time. Then what I think is very entertaining is that in 1934 three American Physicians minoo Murphy and Whipple got the Nobel Prize for curing anemia.

[00:38:41] Pernicious anemia, that's the B12 form Nobel Prize and they use the same product. Do you know what it was called The Royal no beef liver. Okay. Okay. They got a Nobel Prize for using beef liver to cure anemia their patients then in 1978. This is a study that [00:39:00] people should read but they won't because it's a fairly rigorous study, but it's by Robert Hodges.

[00:39:07] In 1978. He blew the whole thing out of the water to prove over a nine hundred day period in subjects that he was studying eight different people that in fact, it's retinol that regulates hemoglobin production and iron has no effect at all is that it's absolutely a stunning study and then that stimulated a series of 31 study.

[00:39:35] Then absolutely prove that he was right and yet today in the modern in the so-called modern era practitioners only use iron to treat quote-unquote anemia because they've been told that it's a ferritin metric that they should be using which should have iron in it. But the form that they're using in the blood doesn't have iron and then the whole thing is like, oh my gosh, this is really getting kind of crazy.

[00:40:00] [00:40:00] But the point is. Vitamin A is profoundly important for making copper bioavailable. That's a very important word. Bioavailable means it has functional use in the body. And if you have the all of the confusion Carl is about measuring iron status in the blood. Vs. Iron status in the tissue then what did you ask for?

[00:40:26] I want to needle biopsy to find out what's really like that. That's the most effective way to find out the actual iron status in the tissue and they use a blood test and they're and they're not using the right markers are not using hemoglobin or not using serum iron. They're not using transferrin or TI DT as you well know and they're measuring it and ferritin which is a complete Distortion of reality.

[00:40:50] So then there's this pronouncement. You're anemic and then I start giving people iron supplements that have been proven time and time and time [00:41:00] again to be ineffective every storing iron status and I have two clients.  To clients that both received an Iron Infusion a week before they delivered their babies and both women almost died and both babies almost died because of the iron infusions.

[00:41:21] The doctors who didn't understand that in fact during a pregnancy. There's something called he mode. I loosen and that hemoglobin is supposed to go down and that's what produces the healthiest babies is when the mother has less hemoglobin than more hemoglobin. And so there's complete and utter confusion about this.

[00:41:43] It's and it's an absolute Delight to be able to have this conversation with you because there are very few people on this planet that understand this the way that you do and I really appreciate that. I don't I don't know. I mean that you flatter me. I'm just trying you know, many of my shows are very selfish because [00:42:00] I have these problems.

[00:42:02] I'm trying to figure things out and I'm trying to put my finger on where the UC and I just had my 23andMe done because my sister was misdiagnosed with Parkinson's disease and I'm confident she was. Big nose because her symptoms are exactly the symptoms that I have and my father had these symptoms to to a lesser degree.

[00:42:21] They weren't as advanced and I'm starting to come to the conclusion that while we may not have the the what does that hematocrit DNA McCoy tell us what he meant. But but but but we obviously have some sort of sensitivity either to the lack of copper or the elevated iron being stored in tissue confident.

[00:42:41] Now absolutely and and Parkinson's it all of the neurodegeneration is taking place in the in the planet right now. It's tied to one phrase copper this homeostasis. Well, that's a big word. Well, what does that mean? It means the [00:43:00] copper is not able to be bioavailable and when copper is not bioavailable and able to express through the ceruloplasmin protein.

[00:43:09] Then iron becomes toxic in the tissue and it's no more complicated than that. That's the whole bit. And the thing is that the body has this very elegant iron recycling program and every 24 hours. We need to produce 24 milligrams of recycles iron and we can all we need is one milligram to come from our diet.

[00:43:35] So we need 25 milligrams a day to make the next day's batch of red blood cells the zillions of red blood cells and.  We need 24 milligrams to come from within the recycling system and only one milligram is supposed to come from our diet. Well that's been completely twisted. Now people think that there should get 20 to 30 40 50 [00:44:00] 60 milligrams from their diet and they're told that what you don't absorb enough and so you need to get on so so what do we have like cereal boxes?

[00:44:08] Yeah. I have everything everything is fortified with iron. I know so and it's based on you get a hundred percent of the iron you need wink wink 18 milligrams of iron is the daily requirement and it's based on 1/2 cup of cereal. Well, who do you. It's 1/2 cup of yeah, no, no. No, sir. You're going to have to create a Tupperware bowls full of it.

[00:44:30] Right exactly exactly because it's by because it's got a lot of sugar there, right? It tastes cubing and then that in there that's iron sugar relationship again. Yeah, and you know what in the 1960s that there's 1960 1963. There's a whole series of studies that they were looking for how sugar helps to increase the.

[00:44:52] Storage the absorption and storage of fire. This is this is not rocket science. They know exactly what they're doing. Why do they start adding [00:45:00] sugar to the food? Because when you refine it and process it it tastes like cardboard, right? So we had to add sugar so you would at least eat it not knowing that that sugar was reacting to the iron that they put in it and all the other stuff that's there and and people just have been completely baffled by the food.

[00:45:21] Over the last 75 years. So how should people be getting their copper and their magnesium should they be supplementing with it or what? Can we do?  Yeah, well again this this is laid out in the root cause protocol cable can download that manual. There's an instruction manual but we really encourage people to get these there really are three components to that protocol.

[00:45:45] There's minerals.

[00:45:50] Ribbon complexes not synthetic derivatives vitamin complexes and nutrient dense food. So things like cod liver [00:46:00] oil and and beef liver are very nutrient-dense beef liver is the highest source of retinol on the planet highest source of B vitamins, especially B12 highest source of something called hyaluronic acid that no one's ever heard of that's really important highest source of choline and a healthy.

[00:46:20] Hello eating grass outside in the sun the way they're supposed to not be exposed to glyphosate. Thank you very much has twice as much copper in that liver as there is iron. That's a great misunderstanding that people think it's just an iron organ. In fact, it's a copper organ. And so that's a that's a very rich source of copper Whole Food vitamin C is very different than ascorbic acid.

[00:46:48] And if and if people think that they're one of the. Then I've got both of used BMW and a bridge. I would love to sell them because nothing could be farther from the truth. And in fact [00:47:00] Albertson gorgui who got the Nobel Prize for so-called discovering vitamin C in July of nineteen Thirty.

[00:47:14] Go ahead that right now 1936 Cuba 1936. So I have 1936 he wrote a letter to the editor of. It's your Journal. So the pecking order is you've got the New England Journal of Medicine looks up to Lancet. And Lance. It looks up to Nature Nature is the top of the pecking order. So we wrote a letter to Nature Journal about his research on hyah, the ironic acid hya the ironic acid and it was talking about its properties and he was very clear.

[00:47:46] I've got the letter. I've got a printout of the letter he said. Score pick acid does not cure scurvy hmm. He's very clear about this is the guy that got the Nobel Prize. What so what does [00:48:00] ascorbic acid trigger that actually hold on hold on. So then December the following year December of 37, he gets the Nobel Prize.

[00:48:10] But they did a switcheroo.  He got the Nobel Prize for hexa uronic acid a chi-x uronic very different than higher veronik acid and the world has never been the same.  It turns out that the studies that are being done with ascorbic acid to cure scary.  They're bogus. There's not there's no study to and please don't play the Linus Pauling Cardinal me because that's just.

[00:48:39] He was a disinformation agent as far as I'm concerned. Ho ho ho ho - calling all over like smoking last point. He cured of their cancer is like let's not let's let's park that one for maybe a conversation next year, but there's so much [00:49:00] deception about ascorbic acid versus Whole Food vitamin C. So that what is Whole Food vitamin C.

[00:49:06] It's a six-part molecule. That has at its core an enzyme called tyrosinase tyrosine. Okay, right and back in the 1950s. It was called thyroxine Ace think it might have something to do with the thyroid gland may be and if you know anything about thyroid peroxidase enzyme in the thyroid. It needs Whole Food vitamin C and they'll tell you it's vitamin C and they'll give you a score back acid telling you that it's vitamin C week wink and and what happens your hypothyroidism only gets worse and for you need more medication and that's the game that's played all over the planet.

[00:49:48] So so eating a okay. So I've been eating grapefruits three to four times organic grapefruit three to four times a week because there's a study out there. I'm sure you probably. [00:50:00] Rivet that shows that I think it's dinner engine in high levels and grapefruit that actually quelles hepatic inflammation from Iron overload Hoosier.

[00:50:11] Tell me that but that got vitamin C in it. That's real vitamin C, right? Yeah. Yeah, and so here's here's the the important thing about citrus. Mother Nature never leaves his hanging there are shining examples of copper Rich vegetation and foods that we can get exposed to but let's take citrus fruit for starter.

[00:50:32] All of those citrus trees grow in iron-rich soil. And in fact, what a farmer's do, they pour blood in the soil to increase the iron content fascinating. So what does Mother Nature do by the nature turns that iron into a cop? Rich fruit called oranges and lemons and grapefruit and somehow mysteriously that iron becomes copper and I don't begin to understand why but that's [00:51:00] the very basis of the importance of vitamin C in a relationship between iron in the soil becomes copper in the.

[00:51:08] That I think is amazing. Is it is it absolutely is and so that's not easily understood by most people but but Farmers know how important that is. And so the thing is we need to have these these Whole Foods forms of. Vitamins, especially vitamin C one of the most important vitamins to regulate iron in the body and another source that we use is bee pollen and I'm sure people certainly see what I've gotten scared off of bee pollen just because of the accumulation of pesticides and herbicides in its I've stopped using it absolutely understand you can find organically grown bee pollen.

[00:51:49] There's a company in Michigan called stake hitch as Tak ice. Eh. They will sell you a very clean bee pollen off. We've got some local farmers here in [00:52:00] the area are very careful about about their problem. But but it has a copper color it does what hear you here's here's what Mother Nature knows you cannot pollinate a flower.

[00:52:13] And you cannot pollinate an animal?  Without copper and so you think maybe that pollen has copper in it, of course the copper deficiency be leading. Some of the problems that people have with fertility today.  Well, if you talk to sheep farmers in Australia, and they and their animals don't get pregnant.

[00:52:35] There's only one element that they add to the feed Hopper. It's called cop. I'll be Dawn absolutely again every I shouldn't say every virtually every condition that you've ever heard of is from to little bioavailable copper and too much Unbound iron. Cole the the proof is in the is in the research and there are hundreds of [00:53:00] scientists around the world that are studying this but none of this research is being exposed to practitioners in their training for one reason only because it kills the business models as I say if you make people if you if you make people impervious to disease you don't have you don't have customers anymore.

[00:53:19] That's right and the thing and it's a turnstile model with big farmer, but. Really great bedrocks of information is the work of Weston a price. You may have heard of him. Oh, yeah, and he he was a dentist who was obsessed with perfect teeth and you probably have always wondered. Why was Weston a price obsessed with perfect teeth because they're interesting.

[00:53:40] They're a representation of Inner Health. I've actually had Sally Fallon on the show numerous times. I've been a big fan of both the price and pottinger's work. Because it speaks it speaks to the Nutritional origins of many many diseases. Well, here's here's the source of why he was obsessed. His ten-year-old son needed a root [00:54:00] canal.

[00:54:01] And so the father gave his son a root canal. And he died really?  He died. And so that's what drove Weston a price and his wife to travel the globe for a decade to find communities that had perfect teeth and then record meticulously what they were eating what what you use a very important word a minute ago about resilience what he discovered where the foods that allowed these indigenous.

[00:54:34] Pleased to have an impervious resistance to disease and have resilience to be able to bounce back from whatever setback they might have and what it was really based on was they were eating 10 times more fat soluble vitamins that we today they were eating four times more minerals and four times more water soluble vitamins when you look back at like I'm Italian right?

[00:54:59] And so [00:55:00] when I look back at the foods that my grandmother made. A lot of them revolve around organ meats, you know try stripe and peas My grandmother used to make a dish called vast edifice which was made from the sweetbreads and the I think the gallbladder of the, you know, we and we've eliminated and and I've talked about this on the show, but I'm an avid Hunter.

[00:55:25] And if you ever find the deer that's been run down by wild dogs. They eat they eat them oval first. They eat all this stuff. They don't even go for the steak meat that we consider so so valuable they eat the organs first the entrails they eat all that. You're absolutely absent right. So so say with your Mediterranean Roots.

[00:55:44] So what what's the what's the issue in the Mediterranean? It's called the Celtic. There's a buildup of iron the Mediterranean soil is very rich with iron don't know whether you knew that or not know I did but but what what does it also have has a lot of foods that have vitamin C. [00:56:00] Especially Tomatoes think that think it's just an accident that there's a lot of.

[00:56:05] I've tomato based dishes in the Italian diet interest and what is what is tomato have it's a fruit. It's not a vegetable. It's actually a fruit. What's the vitamin that's delivered by Tomatoes vitamin C. Wow. It's a very rich source of vitamin C. And so the bioavailable copper in that vitamin C that time most Nations.

[00:56:30] I'm at the very core of vitamin C. He has a it's a it's a three-sided pyramid.  And it and it has a copper atom that all four points and that tyrosinase enzyme is what enables melanin production which enables which enables you to have a swarthy complexion. I wanted so read the reason I'm so dark. I know.

[00:56:55] Exactly. And so that's that's encoded in your body. But what most people don't know [00:57:00] is that that depending upon where you are in the pecking order of life forms.  And you had your vertebrate you have one black dot when your spine and at the very top of the pecking order you have 12 dots when your spine in humans have 12.

[00:57:16] Chimpanzees have 11 spots. Literally we ought we have spots at the top of our spine neck black spots, whatever spine absolutely and and the and if the central nervous system doesn't have access to bioavailable Copper. We get Alzheimer's and Parkinson's and Lou Gehrig's Disease and multiple sclerosis and Huntington's disease and fritters friedreich's Ataxia and a few other things.

[00:57:43] Is this began to strike home. Now. I felt I want to talk about magnesium sources in a second. But before we go there I want to ask you other things that actually deplete copper. I have a funny feeling that grains deplete copper, but maybe I'm wrong forgive me for laughing again. [00:58:00] Let's go back. Fact that that they decimated copper in the soil.

[00:58:06] There's a wonderful book for your listeners to track down its by Andre Vasa voi as I am. He was a Frenchman who lived in England he lived in the Normandy region of England and he was a world-renowned biochemist, but he loved being being a Dairy Farmer and he wrote a wonderful book called soil grass.

[00:58:29] Cancer and this was published in 1957 and it's an amazing study of how the lack of copper in the soil prevented Copper from getting into the grass preventer Copper from getting into the milk of his cows which meant it was not getting into his customers who are getting cancer. And so yes, in fact, there are things that are taking copper out of the soil.

[00:58:54] So number one is. High fructose corn syrup [00:59:00] really and absolutely and it's a major copper key later and it will pull copper out of the tissue and it will prevent Copper from getting inside the cell another major copper key later is glyphosate and what's important about that is it will chelate copper down to a pH of 1.

[00:59:25] Our stomach acid is it 2.0? So it's below stomach acid. It's going to hold onto it all the way through the system. So that what is glyphosate do it? Make sure that there's no copper in the soil. No copper in the plant will copper in the animal and no copper in the human. Holy man, you know, I've done shows with dr.

[00:59:45] Anthony Sam cell and also with with I can't think of her name right now, but I've done shows. Yes, and I about about glyphosate. But this is a new one. Don't talk about composition and talk about Comfort. No. No, she [01:00:00] sold me into meeting income in Chicago about a about a year ago. She said more than would you like to know why glyphosate is so dangerous to Copper.

[01:00:08] I went. Yeah, and that's where I learned that so then another many of your listeners probably know that there seems to be some causal connection between vaccines and autism. We don't I'm not trying to bring up a yeah go get your guilt. Third rail but yes, go ahead good. But the issue this was started by Bill Davis William Davis of the Great Plains laboratory.

[01:00:32] It was never the vaccine. It was the Tylenol that was being given to the children after they got the vaccine and what is Tylenol do is it kills the glutathione cycle in the liver, which is all entirely dependent on. And so the whole mechanism of protecting the cell and the important role between copper and glutathione peroxidase gets destroyed.

[01:01:00] [01:00:59] Another major source of destroying copper status is called ascorbic acid and most people don't they just think wisely I'll take whatever whatever the doctor says and bright. It's like ascorbic acid is poison period and what does ascorbic acid do it it attacks this protein called saru. Plasma and it it causes a key tyrosine amino acid to get rusty and the hatch door opens and the copper start to leak out of the protein and that protein supposed to have 6 Copper atoms inside.

[01:01:37] It is one of the most important proteins in the human body. And so ascorbic acid is causing the rise of Unbound copper in the. And those are just you know, a few examples of some of the problems that we have. Another would be a lot of people may be familiar with the use of cisplatin. It's a it's a chemotherapy.

[01:01:58] Yeah [01:02:00] based on Platinum. And what is this Latin? Do it kills a major copper transporter inside the cell to prevent the production of ceruloplasmin, which is so important in our body. I want to talk more about ceruloplasmin. I want to take I want to take a break real quick. That's funny. And then I want to also talk about the root cause protocol stay tuned.

[01:02:19] We'll be right back with more superhuman radio. Welcome back trying to get everything turned back on the before. We took the break. We're talking with Marley Robbins. This is fascinating. It really is fascinating and but it's not surprising. Okay, so someone just p.m. Me and asked me if that was a real billboard.

[01:02:36] Yes. It is. It was in Southern Indiana. I put it up there to try to attract more local listeners to the show and it did work. It's a real billboard.  Before we get into Cyril plasmon. You just texted me a couple things that have really fascinating to me because.  because.  obstructive sleep apnea is rampant in our [01:03:00] population today and it's not related to the girth of the neck because I know people who are extremely skinny who snore my poor sister.

[01:03:11] Her stomach. She was 98 pounds her whole life. Very she was very small the joke was they? No one believed she could be my sister.

[01:03:21] And she had a horribly distended stomach.  And she snored like a frigging freight train and she was skinny as a rail. And I see people out there today that have obstructive sleep apnea. They have gut issues. I've been I've been connecting dots and saying the up struct of sleep apnea is a result of the gut issue because the edema travels up into the esophagus into the into the but you're telling me that there's actually a correlation with copper and iron to that as well, right?

[01:03:55] Well sure, let's think about it. So we live on a planet that has iron and [01:04:00] we we also live in a plant that has oxygen. So the body needs to have lots of bioavailable copper to activate that oxygen and when we're sleeping again, we are respiring at a lower rate. But but what's important to understand is the body senses whether it has enough.

[01:04:23] Capacity to work with the oxygen that's coming in and if it doesn't have enough it's the thing is that there's a very sophisticated triage function in the body and what the body says is I got to keep the brain going got to get the heart going to give kidneys to know there's certain organ functions a definitely have to stay in optimal condition.

[01:04:47] In Psych, I don't have enough copper to to go around and I'm sorry in this low respired State. I've got a diverted somewhere else and it's in the literature that this if [01:05:00] there's a connection between sleep apnea and okay. Well, let's explore let's explore that a little bit further. So there's two types of sleep apnea is obstructive and their Central so Central is being triggered by the brain thinking.

[01:05:14] Something is wrong with the oxygen level and and obviously obstructive means that there's a mechanical collapse of the plumbing so to speak but form follows function Carl.  The body's going to adapt to the physiological capacity of the body and see if interesting because the obstructive sleep apnea increases hematocrit you see and it also increases D-dimer which leads to clotting.

[01:05:41] So that's an interesting relationship as well. Again, the flip side is if there's low copper I can a very important study was done in 1928 at the University of Wisconsin by for luminary scientists heart steenbok. Would L and L [01:06:00] VM and in 1928 what they concluded convincingly and with a compelling study was that lack of copper?

[01:06:10] Caused iron to store in the organism principally in the liver. This was 1928. The people want a more recent study. They can go to Ming so long as Ong 2018. She make presents a very compelling study about high fructose corn syrup. Causing iron overload and non-alcoholic fatty liver disease. We've got 90 years of scientific proof that this low copper creates high iron in the tissue which shows low in the blood because there's an inflammatory process taking and anytime there's inflammation the body sequester's iron out of the blue.

[01:06:53] Because there's a conserved response that says good bacteria are in the gut bad bacteria in the blood [01:07:00] and we got to get the iron out of the blood because it's going to cause an infection. So another thing that you're pointing to then is we have a lot of autoimmune disorders today, which is basically the immune system going, awry and inflammation is the army of the immune system it deploys inflammation to fix stuff.

[01:07:22] And so what is iron doing to the immune system that's turning on inflammation. Is it because it's just so caustic. It's like having a little Shard of metal in every single cell that we have the body trying to respond to.  Whether the mute the backbone of the immune. There's there's two components. I would say that there's a structural component called the macrophage which Hunter people have heard of monocytes that they're in the blood and then they take up residence there called macrophages but macrophages and.

[01:07:58] Copper-based enzymes. There's [01:08:00] a whole class of what are called anti oxidant enzymes that are designed to neutralize the oxidants that the pathogens like to shoot at us. You know, the bad guys like to have guns with bullets. Well the pathogens like to have guns with oxidants same thing and we're in doubt as you noted earlier we have this capacity.

[01:08:23] To neutralize and deactivate these oxidants but you got to have copper in order to do that. So when we come back to the macrophages, they actually exist in two states. There's and I'm simplifying it's a little bit more complicated but broad Strokes there's an M1 function. And that's an inflammatory process and then there's a m-- to function and that's tissue repair.

[01:08:51] Well, M1 is ruled by Iron and M2 is ruled by copper. Wow, and and the thing is the body needs to be [01:09:00] able to toggle back and forth and have plasticity have resilience that you were talking about and be able to adapt to the environment. Well, what happened is the macrophage. Have gotten iron loaded, they don't think anymore they can't process because if there are full of iron and this is not my idea Carl.

[01:09:24] This is the Leading Edge research of Nancy Andrews who's the former dean of medicine at Duke University after former dean of the medical school at Duke University. Rebecca King who is a world-renowned pathologist at Mayo Clinic and the work of Marion wessling Resnick. The world-renowned biologist and geneticist and all school in Boston called Harvard.

[01:09:47] But what if one of these three women have been converging on this iron Laden origin for all autoimmune conditions? So [01:10:00] the new buzzword in the supplement industry is resolved INS What You're basically describing is that copper is the master resolving. It actually resolves inflammation and causes tissue repair.

[01:10:12] The job is done in the workers couldn't go home. Absolutely and it in the thing is if we were just to focus on magnesium and copper.  In our diet, we would not be taking supplements the way we do we would not be taking medications the way there so I don't want to I don't want to go over things that people can read in the end the in your protocol on your website.

[01:10:35] I'm going to ask you to give your website again, but in the in that document, do you give the foods that people? Eating more of to get more copper and get more magnesium.  Yeah. Yeah, we try to lay it out and if it's and if it's not clear enough for people they are certainly welcome to reach out to me.

[01:10:52] They're not give out my email address all the time. It's morally Robbins at gmail.com. And I'm very happy to have people I [01:11:00] can give you a website again to real quick. Yeah, it's our CP 1 2 3 dot o-- r-- g-- Okay. So the new the new. Margot of the anti aging Community is something called a senescent cell.

[01:11:17] I've had doctors McHale blackish bony on the show several times and we also had another doctor who did a study on rodents and there seems to be relationship between mtor and senescent cell development. But also, There are ways to turn senescent cells back into quiescent cells or at least make them act more like quiescent cells so that they're not toxifying the healthy cells around them and converting those cells into zombies as well.

[01:11:49] So tell me something about what you have discovered and how does it fit into this whole senescent cell theory of Aging?  so very [01:12:00] important study for people to look at is by. To Lilia and Ames Bruce Ames was of he was all I was on it was on my show in 2007 talking about a blue dye called methyl something that actually was effective on treating Alzheimer's disease.

[01:12:19] He's the he was he was brilliant and he was so gracious to even come on the show back then because I had no audience back. Yeah, now he's a very inter-class guy and there was a point before he retired. He was the most quoted scientist on the planet. Yeah, so when Bruce Ames speaks people listen, and so he and his colleague.

[01:12:43] Dr. Kill Alia and there were some others but those are the two principal authors there to study in 2003 of senescent cells. Wow, and what they discovered is that there's 10 times more iron in a [01:13:00] senescence cell.  And and guess what turns on mtor faster than anything else in the planet iron and guess what creates otology?

[01:13:12] Retinol vitamin A. So what here's a here's a little Nuance for the for your list. They should go through their memory banks of any condition that they've ever heard of or had experience with that begins with the letter a as an apple. And every one of those conditions is clear with. Every one of them anemia appendicitis apathy even apathy is a sign of iron overload really and there's a whole just go into a dictionary just start looking all the conditions with the letter a and every one of them is cleared.

[01:13:53] Retinol will vitamin A based on the research of Robert Hodges from 1978 [01:14:00] again. It's it's embarrassing that we don't know this and and you're absolutely right iron is it's boring. It's too bad. It's not sexy set stem cells a second, you know what I mean? But here's guess what keeps themselves Young?

[01:14:16] Five available copper ding ding ding, but but he is it so I started taking a paying attention to real vitamin A about eight years ago when I did a show on stem cell and the scientist was talking about stem cells and they were talking about. How they get stem cells to differentiate in a Petri dish and it works this way in humans.

[01:14:39] And he said you need real vitamin A. I said wait a minute what he goes. Well in order in order for stem cell to differentiate it requires activation of the retinoid X receptor and Sue retinoid and I and he said so we use real and I said at that moment in time. Nature didn't give us themselves [01:15:00] so they could be harvested centrifuged and shot back into US those are the natural repair mechanisms of our body and if we don't have enough vitamin A the body can't repair anything and that's when I started focus on taking vitamin A.

[01:15:12] Here's what here's what your listeners don't understand. They did not know or they do not know that vitamin A and vitamin D our biological antagonists what they don't know is that they are both hormones that calcitriol the active form of vitamin D is a hormone and the retinoic acid of the retinol.

[01:15:36] Is a hormone and there's there's all-trans retinoic acid. There's nine sis 11-cis 13 s has there's four different forms of hormones coming out of that retinol and then you just alluded to the rxr the retinoid X receptor and that is the Gateway for What's called the promoter region of the Gene and what you're what you're going to find as you get into the research is [01:16:00] that rxr likes to be around this buddy cop?

[01:16:04] In order to make the gene work, right?  And if and if there's not enough copper and rxr, the gym doesn't work, right and then Ronnie comes in with his oxygen to cause rust and that's when the Gene gets tweaked by the hydroxyl radical which is the most destructive biomolecule in the planet Earth.

[01:16:26] It's all Iron induced, right? Oh, and what's what what a lot of people don't know is that there's a hundred times more? In defects in the mitochondrial genes than there are in the nuclear genome, right which are more important right way more important. Yeah, and and what what dominates the mitochondria bioavailable cop?

[01:16:48] Right in so clear that that's the that's the driver. That's the key and yes iron is doing its dutiful part to carry an oxygen iron is doing its do for part to carry [01:17:00] in electrons on what are called cytochrome shows that that's fine, but we got to get past this idea that iron is not a catalytic. It's a structural agent just like in our buildings that we live in and work in there's a lot of Steel.

[01:17:17] Right? Right, and that's what that's what allows the tall building to stand still is steel. Right? So, what's the what's the element that allows a tall building to move? It's called copper and we move things through the wires and the plumbing.  And the electrons move through wires and the water moves through copper piping and and that's exactly the way the human body works too.

[01:17:45] We have a question from Gary. I hope I get your name right? Kurkjian. He says do I take vitamin D? Morally doesn't recommend that just curious on your views. I do take vitamin D. But I take vitamin A as [01:18:00] well, and I usually get my vitamin D through the sun. I'm a huge Sun worshiper. I can tell you that I want to live in a sunny climate again because I love to lay in the Sun and of irony is that my grandmother on my father's side apparently was always in the Sun but yes, I do supplement with vitamin D, but I also.

[01:18:22] Take now I take cod liver oil before I was taking retinyl palmitate with it because I have always drawn the conclusion that both of them were important in concert with each other. So now you tell me.  well, I'm not just me just clarify for Gary sake I encourage people to take cod liver oil and to eat foods that are going to have vitamin D in them, but I really discourage people from from taking isolated synthetic.

[01:18:52] Soy based toxic swill called Vitamin D supplements because they don't understand that low vitamin D. As a [01:19:00] number is a clinical sign of inflammation and the an inflammation is a sign of low magnesium and high iron and what the vitamin D supplement is going to do is going to further deplete the magnesium and further in bed the iron in the tissue to cause more inflammation.

[01:19:17] That's why I don't recommend it because it's it's more than managing a number. Managing nature and understanding how nature works with these nutrients and this Obsession that people have with with vitamin D is completely off base and not supported in the research, right? And that's why a lot of the vitamin D research doesn't work out.

[01:19:38] But anyway, I don't want to get I don't want to get too far down too far down the road vitamin D rabbit hole right now. So let's talk about did we cover everything we need to cover about ceruloplasmin. Did you say that it's available. Bull fight the through the medical not to through the Physicians.

[01:19:55] It's only a research chemical. Yeah. I sent you an article that clearly [01:20:00] states that they they have what's called purified human ceruloplasmin for the four-legged rats, but the two-legged rats can't buy. So what would what so what if we could get your ruler plasmon, what would it do for us? It would it would mobilize the iron recycling system in our bodies and people would not have anemia anymore.

[01:20:20] People would not be taking iron supplements. People would have more energy less sleep apnea. They have less Alzheimer's they would have more and better digestion. I mean the list would go on. It would it would be staggering what would happen with just that one protein? And nobody haven't covered through the plasma because it has at least 15 different enzymatic functions that I've been able to identify and I'm I'm working part-time Rhyme Time.

[01:20:48] This is a hobby for me that the guy who knows the most about my of this protein. His name is Paul Fox and Cleveland Clinic. He's not a forty seven studies on [01:21:00] ceruloplasmin alone here. I would I would love for him to write a book about it, but I doubt he will. And so there's an inside track on what ceruloplasmin does Paul Fox knows what's going on, but I would I would be willing to give $1000 to any practitioner who's ever talked to Paul Fox about the power of Sulu plasma the human body.

[01:21:21] So I think I'm going to lose that. Yeah, so real quick. It's so it is it appropriate to think that there are steps to helping us excrete iron or manage it and is that also in your protocol or do you have to donate blood?  What? Yeah, you do the protocol.  Has a series of nutrients and food. Stop taking like stop taking vitamin D.

[01:21:53] Stop taking iron. Stop taking you know, calcium. I mean, there's just it's like those are insane [01:22:00] supplements to be taking and then seriously things to start doing and then there's three things that we encourage people to do one is to donate blood. The second is to release their fears is a very powerful emotional physiology component may be because also let yeah and I want to talk about that briefly.

[01:22:22] But here's what I want to do. I want to reframe it into stress because stress is fear manifest. Yeah. So what you, you know, if you say to people release your fears now all of a sudden it gets kind of touchy-feely new-agey, but if you say. Managers stress people go. Oh, yeah, how do I do that? I'm under stress all the time.

[01:22:45] My mortgage my job my kids and her so let's reframe it under stress, please and I do that regularly what people need to understand is that that when we are under stress,  [01:23:00] We have coined the phrase. We have an increased magnesium burn rate and when we're losing magnesium our capacity to take on. Iron goes off like a rocket and what happens when we have chronic stress is that the liver produces a protein called Metallo thiamine, which binds up copper batalla thousand times stronger.

[01:23:24] It binds of copper a thousand times stronger than it binds up. Zinc to please don't start taking zinc supplements is a very bad supplement to take can get in your diet, but not in a supplement. But but the stress does in fact lock up and. This two key Minerals Magnesium copper and then iron starts to take off and so that the dynamic that people need to understand is that when they are in a state of stress.

[01:23:53] They are in fact attracting iron and the reason why I focus on fear, [01:24:00] not my idea Recent research from December of 2018. Author's name is Zaman Pura Z am inpi IRA. His colleagues from the Middle East that the title of the article says it all chronic fear creates hypoxia, which creates cancer. It's a very powerful study about the real truth of the metabolics of how our body works and I encourage people to do emotional freedom.

[01:24:33] To do with the underlying stress that you're referring to but it's really the fear as you connected those two and I think emotional Freedom technique done with a practitioner. There's a specific reason why you need to use a practitioner is a very powerful way to lower the magnet that you have for pulling iron into your being.

[01:24:59] So [01:25:00] I sleep with a. For 20 years. I have slept with a pulse electromagnetic field device under my mattress.  Sure, and I can tell you with complete confidence.  Excuse me.  that. As my iron overload increased my sensitivity to that magnet increase and it makes perfect sense. I became an antenna basically and absolute where I used to be able to sleep with that magnet on 70.

[01:25:30] I have to sleep with it on 30 now if I put it up to 70, I can actually feel the pulsations in my tissue because the iron is being pulled by. Right. Absolutely. It's because of the lack of bioavailable copper in our body the iron becomes a giant antenna. You're absolutely right and it's the EMS.

[01:25:53] It's the it's the blue light you and I are being pummeled with blue light all day long and so are the listeners [01:26:00] and what people didn't realize is that blue light is the start of the UV spectrum that causes iron buildup in the eye really? Really do you think maybe they had a reason for making all these devices run on Blue Light to people don't know that this this thing called our eyeball is actually a nerve ending.

[01:26:22] It's not an organ. It's a nerve ending from the brain obviously. Well, the biggest production of ceruloplasmin the bodies is called the liver and the second biggest production is called the brain. Until I read a study by dr. Chen at Northwestern in 2004 and what 2008 scuse me what he discovered was that there's eight times more ceruloplasmin being made in the eyeball than in the brain.

[01:26:52] Wow.  And that is to protect the retina from the constant bombardment of light [01:27:00] that is very toxic to the tissue. If it doesn't have the ability to neutralize the oxidants caused by that exposure to all that oxygen and Light.  The the age-related macular degeneration absolutely a lack of bioavailable copper in excess iron.

[01:27:24] I've got 20 studies like, okay, so wait a minute. So there was that there's a really good study we talked about on the show end of last year. Maybe we the beginning that and the last year that shows that. Age-related macular degeneration.  Can be stalled and even reversed by taking a melatonin supplement.

[01:27:42] Now, I am not promoting people take melatonin. But what I am saying is that melatonin seems to protect against the development of it. And if you're sitting in front of a TV all night long without blue blockers on your body's not making hardly any melatonin so we can drink melatonin [01:28:00] have any relationship with within this discussion.

[01:28:03] Well, it's an antioxidant that that's important for people to understand that it's a master antioxidant, right? I don't know the actual pathway between the precursor to melatonin the military where copper might fit in but again any time what what does the phrase antioxidant mean? It means it Chi-Lites iron and gets it out of the way, so it doesn't cause rust.

[01:28:31] It doesn't matter whether we're talking about herbs interesting or essential oils or hormones or enzymes. Whatever anytime you see the word antioxidant. It means a chelate iron very important principle. Okay. So people go to your website give it again one more time. I want to make sure there's plenty of opportunities for people go there appreciate that our CP 1 2 3 Dot o-- r-- g--.

[01:28:58] and that stands for the for root [01:29:00] cause protocol that RC. 1 2 3 dot orgy and they can download for free this protocol.  Absolutely. Yeah, I give I give away the answer. Now. What I encourage people to do is I think it helps people to do both hair testing and blood testing so they have a better context for what the stress of life.

[01:29:22] Did to lower and dis regulate their minerals and we use the hair test in the blood test as Educational Tools not diagnostic tools. We don't diagnose anything. We don't treat anything. All we're doing is helping people restore the resilience that our ancestors had because they had a better diet there to do.

[01:29:49] That's that's really that's all it is. It's a very simple and basic one of my colleagues is is very excited about this. He's a he's a practitioner and he's involved in this this big project and and [01:30:00] he's he's really like this is this is going to have profound implications. I said, well, I want to make sure you understand what's going on here.

[01:30:06] Basically what this root cause protocol does is it takes the engine out of allopathic medicine and replaces it with a rubber band. Anyway, wow, that's pretty powerful I said and that's how simple it is, but it still works. And so I think it's time for people to realize that we have been pummeled with complexity because it's a source of stress for us.

[01:30:33] We've been we've been exposed to this notion that we are broken with his belief that we have broken jeans with this belief that we were born with labels and it and I'm sorry. I can't cure them since 1992 as a practitioner. I'm I'm not allowed to say the word cure. It's a four-letter word in medicine.

[01:30:52] Now, I can treat them on. I'll treat them all day long. Come on. That's why that's why I went on this [01:31:00] Quest was to find the solution and get to the root cause of all of these problems and and I'm very confident that given the tens of thousands of people around the world that are doing this protocol and I get letters and notes.

[01:31:14] Love all the time. Thanking me for saving their life. I have no idea who they are. And I'm very I'm very honored to be on this path and have a chance to share it with you to do that. That's a good photo the last couple questions. So when someone starts the route calls cause protocol. Yeah, how long assuming they adhere to all of your guidance in the protocol?

[01:31:35] How long do they start to notice things changing in their life and their bodies?  Okay, the two questions that everyone asked me. Everyone including this gifted show host today is how long is it going to take and to what else do I need to take besides the root cause protocol. So what I what I tell folks is.

[01:32:02] [01:32:00] To plan on actually my first response is how long do you want it to take because that's a very important thing is if you think you're broken that's going to affect your ability to rebuild yourself, but what I typically advise people is plan on at least 18 months to two years to allow your body to rebuild itself because it probably took five years to get where it is.

[01:32:23] For over 50, right? And yep, and then the throughout what else should I take the size the root cause protocol. I just encourage people to let's see what the root cause protocol does for you first. We can always add other bells and whistles because what we've been raised in a society to do is well, let's throw everything including the kitchen sink at it and just hope that it works.

[01:32:46] Right? Well the body gets confused too much signaling overwhelms the immune system. It doesn't know which way to go. So we're really we're trying to use feathers to stimulate before we start to use sledgehammers [01:33:00] and last question. It just dawned on me. So we are we are infatuated with nitric oxide precursor supplements beetroot juice and nitric oxide in my humble opinion is turned on by stress when you think about what when does the body produce nitric oxide to dilate vasculature?

[01:33:21] The body is freaking out right now. So everybody's taking these nitric oxide precursors today and being told that they're going to be healthier age better have better erections. How does that effect doesn't that create nitrosamine, 's when it comes in contact with iron.  Absolutely does and in a body that has low bioavailable copper which has low functional ceruloplasmin protein.

[01:33:50] That nitric oxide is like a bomb going off in the body because what there again there, I've identified 15 different enzyme functions for [01:34:00] ceruloplasmin two of them involve nitric oxide one is it's a nitric oxide oxidase, which is a very important thing and the other is a nitrite synthase. No, I don't want to get super technical with people.

[01:34:17] But if you don't have the ability to oxidize nitric oxide and synthesize nitrate when you take those precursor supplements, you're just increasing the potential for chaos in your body, especially if you. Iron dysregulation, which I'm confident every one of your listeners has only the people who have anemia because it's all that iron is stuck in their tissue.

[01:34:43] It's not in their blood.  I want to end on this one thing. So since I discovered and became so interested in Iron, I started to tell people in order to. Exemplify the how [01:35:00] Iron bioaccumulates that chances. Are you still have the iron from in your body from a hamburger you ate when you were 14 years old, that's not true.

[01:35:09] Is it?  Well, that's a scary thought isn't it? Well, but when it does kind of hit home like oh man, this stuff is just building up in my body every day. You said a milligram a day we. Right. Well, it is building up in the body. And the again the mythology is that oh, you've got a milligram coming in and you've got a milligram going out.

[01:35:33] No, that's not what the research says. So I think people I'm not sure that we still have that iron from the the Big Mac from from 14, but there's no question. We have been exposed especially in this nation. Look what people need to understand is that they started adding iron filings to the food system in the UK Canada and the United States in [01:36:00] 1941.

[01:36:00] Geez, I'm findings iron filings are inorganic ions. What does inorganic means means is toxic means it causes immediate rust means that inside our body. We look like that pickup truck that you had at the beginning and people don't realize that in the all this obsession with gluten. No, it was the iron they were adding to the wheat flour, but that's was very toxic for our digestive system.

[01:36:28] And so people need to understand again. I would love to work with you Carl to make iron sexy. I don't know how to do it. But but it's what's needed is for people to become much more aware of this Primal metal and its destructive capacity to Aegis and diseases. It really is the. The Peace of the whole process of oxidative stress at then creates symptoms that then creates labels that we think we're broken [01:37:00] from morally.

[01:37:00] I'm sure we'll be doing this again you and I I'm sure that the audience that's listening right now. If you send me questions to on are at superhuman radio dotnet will plan another show because I find that my audience is really able to do this job and I have the smartest audience in. I mean that sincerely and I think that they'll have some really good questions that I missed and then we can come back on and we can address from there.

[01:37:28] We'll just keep building on this this beginning.  I love it. It's a great great start and I appreciate the chance to have this and I will reach out to you after I download your protocol traveling tomorrow, but after I download your protocol and I should read it through I'll reach out to you. I'll get started on it.

[01:37:44] And since great look forward to working with you. All right. Thanks for being here today more like thank you. Okay. Take care. And that's it for today. I will see everybody. Let's see. I'm off tomorrow [01:38:00] because I'm traveling to the Arnold anybody who's going to be at the Arnold. Please come see me on Saturday at the redcon one booth and say hello, and then we'll be back on the air Tuesday because Monday I've got something I have to do personally, so I'll be back on the air next Tuesday, but watch for me on Facebook and Instagram.

[01:38:18] I'll be at the Arnold. And fun, and I'm sure I'll get some good stuff good interviews while I'm there to I talk to you soon.

[01:38:35] I don't know what that was, but we're just going to end the show now. Okay. Bye. Bye.