[00:00:00] Carl Lanore: [00:00:00] hey, Hey, welcome back to another episode of super human radio. Today is, uh, November 25th, 2000, 19. For those of you listening to this show a hundred years from now, and you realize that we will way ahead of the curve. We're way ahead of the curve of everybody today. I just got the most beautiful testimonial from Ron Penna, uh, the original founder of quest nutrition, who just started a new company called legendary foods.
[00:00:26] Why legendary foods is signed up to be the title sponsor of supremer radio for 2020. But, uh, that, that's, we'll save that for another show. So. I started talking about, uh, katsu. I actually had a Japanese scientist on in around 2000 end of 2006 if I remember correctly, I went back and looked at some of this information.
[00:00:50] Talking about a method of using vascular, a restriction, blood flow restriction to help wounds and [00:01:00] injuries recover faster. And when we saw the value of that in this, uh, wound recovery, uh, scenario, everybody started thinking, wait a minute, what if you're not wounded? What if you don't have an injury to recover from?
[00:01:14] What if you start employing this blood flow restriction? Technique to healthy muscles to help them grow faster, get bigger. Uh, and sure enough, uh, a lot of the early research showed that there was real efficacy here. Now I gotta say something, and you've heard me say this before, in 14 years.
[00:01:37] Excuse me. When stuff works, it's great, but there's a responsibility not to abuse it. I've you, you've heard me say these words numerous times talking recently about IGF one long are three. The good news is BFR works. The bad news is BFR works. If you don't know what you're doing. It [00:02:00] may not be a good outcome.
[00:02:02] Let's just say that and we're going to get to the bottom of that. The reason I say this upfront is because everything we discussed from this point forward will be, uh, prefaced on the right way of doing that. Uh, my guest today is Dr. James stray Gundersen. He was actually on my show, uh, talking about BFR all the way back in 2015.
[00:02:26] It's been a long time. How you doing, dr? Stray Gundersen.
[00:02:29] Dr. Stray-Gunderson: [00:02:29] Ah, very good, Carl. Thank you.
[00:02:30] Carl Lanore: [00:02:30] Yes. So, um, a lot of this stuff we talked about in 2015 actually has come to fruition now. Um, but I wanna I wanna I wanna get this out there upfront again. You heard what I said about things that work and not abusing them.
[00:02:45] Right? So the same is true of this, this, this, this, this, science, this, this, pro, this product because, uh, it, it can be misused. Correct.
[00:02:57] Dr. Stray-Gunderson: [00:02:57] Um. the general [00:03:00] category, yes, it can be misused. And in particular some, most of the products that are out there are either too expensive or, and where they have the safety things in place or they're inexpensive, and then they're unlikely to be safe or effective.
[00:03:18] And I think we kinda hit it out of the park with a Making a product that we hope will be, well, we would say idiot proof and, uh, able to be safe and effective at all times.
[00:03:30] Carl Lanore: [00:03:30] No, I want to say upfront that I've used this product and I, and I have to say, I want, I want to build on this a little bit and I actually shared some of these thoughts with, with your wife Holly.
[00:03:41] Um. I have always looked at BFR like, Oh man, you know, come on, give me a break. I'm going to put things up on my arms and my legs. I'm just going to go in there and train. And that's it. And I have stayed away from BFR, and I'm, I'm really honest because I didn't want to be that guy in the [00:04:00] gym, which with the paraffin, he'll yawn.
[00:04:02] But, but because I started to experiment with it, not only did I realize that I had been completely mistaken. For feeling that way. Uh, because the reality is that this is a super, uh, opportunity to increase the efficiency of every workout. Uh, but I made a statement on a show a couple of weeks ago, and I think I can say this, uh, with all humility, because I've used a lot of gear in my day.
[00:04:33] I mean, everybody on my show knows that I've used very, very high doses of anabolic steroids. Uh, for, for many, many years, I don't any longer. Now I'm 61 years old. I use sensible dose of testosterone, but I had better results with these, this BFR, uh, blood flow restriction training system from be strong and just a couple of weeks than I've ever seen on any high [00:05:00] doses of anabolic steroids.
[00:05:01] And I actually said, excuse me, I have actually said. That th that the be strong system is, is, is more effective at building muscle into targeted muscles than anabolic steroids. And I know that you probably would get real far away from a statement like that, but I, but it's, um, and ever since I've said that people have bought the system and I'm getting messages and posts on Facebook where people go on, I couldn't, I never thought my arms could be this big.
[00:05:33] Dr. Stray-Gunderson: [00:05:33] Yeah, I, Carl, I think you're right on. Um, I view this as a natural, a safe way of getting the same effects that people can get with antibiotic steroids or growth hormone or that sort of thing.
[00:05:50] Carl Lanore: [00:05:50] So let's talk about wearing them. So I'm under the impression. From my own personal experience when I wear them on my upper arms and I train arms, [00:06:00] I notice a great pump in my shoulders.
[00:06:03] Is it in fact, since it's restricting blood flow in and out of the limb, but is it not increasing the pressure and air go? You're getting that same pump effect in the muscle, you just North of the, uh, of the BFR band. Very,
[00:06:21] Dr. Stray-Gunderson: [00:06:21] very good. That's very astute, Carl. Uh, what happens is we are changing the character of the venous flow out of the muscle, out of the extremity.
[00:06:32] But what that does is it kind of screws up the timing to deliver blood and oxygen to not only the muscles that are below the band, but also muscles that are active in the exercise that are above the bands. So for example, if you're doing a bench press, your act, you're, you're getting fatigue in your PEX as well as some of the other muscles that are, that you're using for that bench press.
[00:06:54] Even though theoretically their blood flow is not being restricted.
[00:07:00] [00:07:00] Carl Lanore: [00:07:00] So, um, another thing, excuse me, I'm sorry. I'm having, I'm still not over this upper respiratory thing. So another thing that I did, and I shared this with Sean Whalen. Uh, I said, you know, uh, I went out to do cardio one morning and I decided to put the BFR bands up on my upper legs.
[00:07:22] And it literally turned a cardio session into what felt like I had been lunging. The couple miles that I walked and my calves, everything were super, super pumped and it made walking more difficult. Is this a sensible thing to use them for?
[00:07:42] Dr. Stray-Gunderson: [00:07:42] Absolutely. And so, uh, let me take a, uh, kind of a larger case.
[00:07:48] And that is, is that for us to make progress in training, we have to perturb the system more than it otherwise is. So that's why, you know, people get used to doing one kind of workout, [00:08:00] whether it's a robotic, uh, running or, uh, whether it's, uh, in, in the weightlifting gym, uh, they kind of plateau cause they get used to doing what they're doing.
[00:08:10] And for people to advance, you have to take, take, go farther. A great, usually when you get to be pretty, when people are pretty accomplished runners or weightlifters or whatever, uh, it's hard to do the extra workouts by just putting the bands on. You can make what is otherwise easy for you. A essentially an interval workout, get a good fatigue signal, and then that translates into this nice hormonal cascade that then takes you farther.
[00:08:41] Carl Lanore: [00:08:41] So whether we're going to talk about that hormonal cascade in a minute and get deeper into it. But, um, what about early on it was said that the only way to use blood flow restriction was with lightweight. But if you're not completely occluding the muscle and [00:09:00] blood flow is still occurring in and out the exchange.
[00:09:04] Right? Why can't you go heavy with these bands on.
[00:09:07] Dr. Stray-Gunderson: [00:09:07] Well. Um, there's nothing to say that, that you can't, we've just found over time, it's most effective to do something where you can do three sets of 30 reps or fail in the last set of 30 reps. and that just can't be too heavy, uh, to be able to do that.
[00:09:26] And, um, but for example, um, uh, there are people who are let, let's say, let's say they're doing a hundred kilos. Um, bench presses, and if they put the bands on, they can get the same really good work out of doing 25 kilo bench presses, which is, uh, safer. And you can actually take it to a farther, uh, or higher extreme of fatigue and then get a better effect from that workout.
[00:09:57] Carl Lanore: [00:09:57] So let's talk about the science behind BFR. It's, it's [00:10:00] come a long way now. Um, the. The science shows that anytime the muscle gets congested, whether through blood flow restriction or just, uh, working in such high volume, that intra muscular growth factors like IGF one McConnell growth factor, which IGF one E they are produced in the muscle themselves, is that as a result.
[00:10:27] Of of lactic, of lactate buildup or is that something else happening that, cause obviously it happens when you're wearing the bands too,
[00:10:35] Dr. Stray-Gunderson: [00:10:35] right. So, um, this, this may be a little complicated, but I'll try to make it as simple as possible.
[00:10:42] Carl Lanore: [00:10:42] No, don't worry about it. My audience is very intelligent.
[00:10:45] Speak like you're speaking to university students. Really?
[00:10:49] Dr. Stray-Gunderson: [00:10:49] Oh, well, they're not so bright.
[00:10:50] Carl Lanore: [00:10:50] Okay. Good. One good one.
[00:10:55] Dr. Stray-Gunderson: [00:10:55] So the basic, the basic thing that, uh, is happening [00:11:00] here with the bands is that we are depriving the working muscle of blood and oxygen at a time when they need it. There's still lots of blood flow.
[00:11:10] There's still lots of oxygen, but it's just not getting to the right place at the right time. The consequence of that hypoxia is there's lots of things that happen. One is you upregulate protein synthesis. Another thing is you upregulate cell surface membrane, uh, receptors, uh, for various hormones.
[00:11:30] Uh. Number number three is you change over to a kind of an anaerobic metabolism where you're producing lactate, which in and of itself stimulates the muscle to adapt. And so those are the local responses to this kind of thing. But then this disturbance of homeostasis or this metabolic crisis that's been.
[00:11:54] Created is sensed by the brain or the CNS, and then read starts to release [00:12:00] this hormonal cascade where not only do you start putting out growth hormone and endorphins and a variety of other things, but that those growth hormones have a number of effects. One is to increase IGF one out of the liver.
[00:12:14] Which then amplifies what's going on in the local tissues, any tissues that were exercising, whether they were distal or proximal to the bands. And then in addition to that, um, growth hormone is lipolytic. It breaks down fat. And so what, what ends up happening is that the outcome of this kind of training on a regular basis, the predominant effect is that those muscles that were worked get stronger and, uh, the individual gets leaner.
[00:12:43] And those two things are, uh, performance enhancers for any age.
[00:12:49] Carl Lanore: [00:12:49] Now you see these in practical application, you work with athletes, correct?
[00:12:55] Dr. Stray-Gunderson: [00:12:55] Absolutely.
[00:12:55] Carl Lanore: [00:12:55] So, so, you know, cause a lot of times we get caught up in the science, but the science doesn't always [00:13:00] translate to the real world. This really is what happens when people use.
[00:13:04] The be strong BFR system regularly, right?
[00:13:07] Dr. Stray-Gunderson: [00:13:07] We, we have, I mean, it's, it's a bit of a secret and not all our athletes really want me talking about this, but we have a number of very prominent athletes who have taken a step up in their performance since starting to use be strong. And in, in all sorts of sports, from marathoning to, uh, weight lifting to, um, everything in between.
[00:13:31] Carl Lanore: [00:13:31] So, so give me an example of how the marathoner is using the be strong bands. Is it using it the way I was using it to take a walk around the neighborhood?
[00:13:40] Dr. Stray-Gunderson: [00:13:40] Uh, well. Kind of, uh, they would, uh, uh, do shorter intervals and running intervals and a shorter runs than they otherwise would, but essentially those absolute workloads would be very trivial for them.
[00:13:59] And so this [00:14:00] is the key to this be strong stuff is, is the idea of doing what are otherwise trivial workloads with the bands on that produced the same effects that a, uh, really hard interval workouts or long runs do.
[00:14:14] Carl Lanore: [00:14:14] So you're actually preserving or, or, or you're, you're staying away from an overtraining, you know, you know, this is central.
[00:14:22] The central nervous system is what ends up crashing, not the, not the peripheral muscles. So you're actually preserving, uh, and training in an area where the body goes, wow, we can manage this, but the muscles are undergoing the same adaptive affects as if you had run three times longer.
[00:14:41] Dr. Stray-Gunderson: [00:14:41] Exactly.
[00:14:42] So here's, here's the thing. Training is all this balance between breakdown and build up from a given training session. And what we do is we really decrease the cost and the absolute workload of that training. And because of that, we get a really nice benefit for adaptation, and the [00:15:00] workout is easier to recover from.
[00:15:01] So you can even do more workouts. So this is a way of getting around the plateau. That often happens with people who are training hard. You know, they get to a point where, you know, yes, they can do another interval workout, but it causes a lot of damage. And it takes a long time to recover, preventing them from doing other sorts of workouts.
[00:15:21] Here we've shifted that balance. That's really what it's all about.
[00:15:24] Carl Lanore: [00:15:24] Now, you said the word interval. So a lot of people love a high intensity interval training as their form of cardio.
[00:15:30] Dr. Stray-Gunderson: [00:15:30] How would the bands on,
[00:15:31] Carl Lanore: [00:15:31] how would I do them with the bands on to get the greatest adaptations with, without pushing my body to extremes?
[00:15:40] Dr. Stray-Gunderson: [00:15:40] Yeah. So, um. For example, uh, I'll, I'll jump to be really, really specific. And that is, uh, you do five times a minute with two to three minutes rest in between. And, uh, uh, you do them with the band side, and you can do it with all four bands,
[00:15:59] Carl Lanore: [00:15:59] five times a [00:16:00] minute or five, one minute, all out sprints,
[00:16:03] Dr. Stray-Gunderson: [00:16:03] five, five, one minute sprints.
[00:16:05] Okay. Okay.
[00:16:07] Carl Lanore: [00:16:07] Okay. And do you even have to push as hard as you normally would since the bands are creating this environment, like you're running faster,
[00:16:16] Dr. Stray-Gunderson: [00:16:16] you're exactly right. You don't have to push as hard as you otherwise would. And what happens is the key to knowing that you're getting an effective session is if you're getting that, those feelings of fatigue.
[00:16:28] And if you're getting the feelings of fatigue, no matter what you're doing, you're, you're going to have an effective
[00:16:32] Carl Lanore: [00:16:32] session. So I have to believe that this, I like to, where I, first of all, I've been doing whole body routines with the band. So I go in with both my upper legs banded off and my upper arms banded off and, and I'll do push pole, I'll do legs, and I move around and I keep things moving.
[00:16:52] And. I do this, I can't help but think that there's some sort of cardiovascular benefit, uh, to the heart [00:17:00] because there is a, you know, you've got this restriction going on, this partitioning of blood, if you will. What is that doing for me systemically?
[00:17:09] Dr. Stray-Gunderson: [00:17:09] Um, while there's two to two systemic influences going on.
[00:17:13] One is, um, along with, uh, growth hormone and IGF one and a variety of other hormones. Um. This, the venous side and the capillaries, they get distended and then collapsed. As you're doing these, these workouts, as there's kind of a dam that's been put in place, uh, uh, in the proximal veins and this, uh, kind of distension.
[00:17:39] And, um, um. Throwing out or pushing out of all this blood ends up stretching the endothelium, which is a stimulus for the endothelium, uh, to adapt. And so we've documented, um, increases in VGF vascular endothelial growth factor, [00:18:00] alpha, uh, the nitric oxide synthase system, enzymes. All of these things are designed to.
[00:18:07] Um, frankly, heal and, and improve and increase the, the amount of endothelium you have. And so that's, that's kind of the secret potion in terms of the vascular system, both for the heart and the blood vessels and everything else. And you can think of this as kind of Draino for atherosclerosis over time.
[00:18:28] So, uh, this is really a very important part to getting vascular adaptations, uh, that benefits you from the, uh, from the work that you're otherwise doing.
[00:18:40] Carl Lanore: [00:18:40] No, I want to inject, of course. Uh, Kirk Yeager sent to me this morning in anticipation of this interview, uh, a paper that was published by dr Brad Schoenfeld and his group.
[00:18:52] Looking at blood flow restriction, but in reality, they were really looking at blood flow occlusion because [00:19:00] what they indicated was that there could be endothelial dysfunction if in fact the blood flow is restricted greater than 70% right. But your product, like you said earlier, is kind of idiot proof.
[00:19:16] You really couldn't completely occlude. Oh yeah. Your product.
[00:19:22] Dr. Stray-Gunderson: [00:19:22] I think at this point I need to explain two main types of, uh, blood flow restriction systems. One is what I would call rigid, and the other is what we call
[00:19:32] Carl Lanore: [00:19:32] Lastic rigid being like a tourniquet, right?
[00:19:34] Dr. Stray-Gunderson: [00:19:34] A
[00:19:35] Carl Lanore: [00:19:35] tourniquet. A lot of people are going out and buying $11 tourniquets and they're just cinching off their upper arms.
[00:19:39] And I think this is a mistake.
[00:19:41] Dr. Stray-Gunderson: [00:19:41] It's crazy. It's, that's, that's exactly the way to not be safe and not be effective. Right. But, um. So imagine a blood pressure cuff. When you put the blood pressure cuff on and the Velcro holds, then there's no way that you can increase the cross sectional area [00:20:00] inside of the inside of the cuff.
[00:20:02] Right? And that's what we call a rigid system. So that goes for surgical tourniquets, any kind of tourniquets, any kind of non elastic belt material. Um, the, the only two, uh. Good systems out there that are elastic, our katsu and be strong. And, uh, we, we get this elasticy in slightly different ways.
[00:20:26] But the point is, is that when you're using these elastic systems compared to the rigid systems, they're much more, uh, they're much safer and they can be end up being much more effective. One of the things about this is you have to get over this venous pressure to restrict the veins in the first place, but when you're using a rigid system, every time the muscle contracts, the pressure just shoots up inside this cross sectional area that has nowhere to go.
[00:20:55] Right. And that puts it above arterial pressure, [00:21:00] which then occludes the extremity. So every, the only way to deal with that is to have an elastic system, which accommodates that increase in cross sectional area of the muscle. And so that's, that's the key differentiator. And I'm, your colleague is right about, uh, uh, the dangers of an exercise pressure response on one hand.
[00:21:23] And, uh, uh. Basically doing a schemic damage when they're talking about Richard cuss,
[00:21:30] Carl Lanore: [00:21:30] and that's what we're talking about here. We're talking about ischemia, which is what happens to the heart and the brain and anything that's getting zero oxygen and being put on the pressure at the same time, which is what potentially happens when you use tourniquets, which are designed to create occlusion.
[00:21:47] All right? Tourniquet is designed to stop the blood from flowing into the limb. So when you go the tourniquet, you're literally creating occlusion, not restriction.
[00:21:57] Dr. Stray-Gunderson: [00:21:57] Absolutely. Right. And this is, [00:22:00] this is lost on most people when they just talk about blood flow restriction. They don't differentiate between these rigid systems and these elastic systems
[00:22:09] Carl Lanore: [00:22:09] and the elastic systems.
[00:22:10] And in simplest terms, they have some give. So as the muscle starts to swell, they give a little bit, and if you can tort and you move in certain angles, they give a little bit as opposed to a tourniquet, which has no give whatsoever and is literally strangling the limit.
[00:22:27] Dr. Stray-Gunderson: [00:22:27] Yeah. And there's another component to this, and that is the width.
[00:22:31] So imagine a blood pressure cuff. You put a blood pressure cuff on your arm, it covers the bicep, right? And then, and then when you do an arm curl, the bicep gets fatter, right? And with a rigid system, there's nowhere to go. The only thing that can happen is that you increase pressure inside that area, causing a ski.
[00:22:51] Mia causing a collusion. All these other sorts of things that you tried hard to avoid. If you have an elastic system and a relatively [00:23:00] narrow one, then all of a sudden, uh, there's no problem.
[00:23:03] Carl Lanore: [00:23:03] Right. Interesting. Very, very interesting. So Lastic is good. Rigid is bad. Interesting. Because I have both.
[00:23:10] Dr. Stray-Gunderson: [00:23:10] Okay.
[00:23:11] Carl Lanore: [00:23:11] I don't know what Bobby is speaking to. Um, but he, um, I'm assuming that he has a blood flow restriction product that he's talking about. Um, anyway, so. There has been a lot of science, uh, on blood flow restriction training. Since you and I first spoke in 2015, has your group been involved with any of that science?
[00:23:34] Dr. Stray-Gunderson: [00:23:34] Um, yes and no. Um, some P, some parts of our group, uh, are separate from the company and have been doing research, uh, particularly at university of Texas in Austin in particular, we've looked at, uh. Two main things. While there's been three, three studies so far. Um, one is, um, looking at this exercise pressure [00:24:00] response for walking, doing five, two minute intervals on a treadmill, walking at two miles an hour, one with a set of, uh, Hokinson.
[00:24:10] Um. Essentially a rigid pneumatic system. And, uh, then with, uh, B strong bands, and then with nothing, just regular walking and, uh, there's a dramatic increase in systolic blood pressure. Um, mean arterial pressure and something called double product, which gives you an indication of workload on the heart when you're using the rigid systems.
[00:24:35] And there's no real difference between the just regular walking and the be strong system. Another one, uh, and that addresses this, uh, complaint that we've seen in the literature in terms of, uh. Spiking blood pressure and being hard on the heart when on when you're using, and that's been with the rigid system, so that's a check Mark against them.
[00:24:58] Then the other study [00:25:00] that's in progress is, um, is one in which, um, cancer patients who are sarcopenia, I've lost a lot of weight and a lot of muscle mass. Yeah. Um, we, we, we, those patients have a pretty tough time postop. Sometimes. Yeah. The amount of morbidity and mortality or death and
[00:25:21] Carl Lanore: [00:25:21] tied.
[00:25:22] Right. It's tied right to fragility and kikexia and they, a lot of times they don't die from cancer. They die from how debilitated their body becomes from the treatment.
[00:25:32] Dr. Stray-Gunderson: [00:25:32] Exactly. Right. And so we have a six week preop program using be strong and creating supplements to see if we can improve their strength and their muscle mass.
[00:25:43] Uh, ahead of the operation. And, uh, so far we have preliminary results at all of our patients are, are getting increases in lean body mass and stronger. So, uh, that's promising, but we ha we don't have enough yet to know that we've influenced morbidity and mortality. And then [00:26:00] a third study as we were looking at, um, uh, the, uh, idea of using, um, uh, bands with a yoga routine.
[00:26:12] And seeing if we can't get, if we can't amplify the benefits of the yoga routine. And, uh, that's, that's looking good so far. And, uh, but that study's in progress,
[00:26:24] Carl Lanore: [00:26:24] you know, and, and, and, and just for the record, sarcopenia is a widespread problem in anybody over. 60 years old today, most people don't eat enough protein or quality protein, a high leucine protein to stimulate mTOR.
[00:26:38] A lot of people are on drugs that are actually suppressing mTOR, and they gradually lose muscle year after year until. They lose the ability to be, to safely be ambulatory, to get out of chairs, and then they go into a nursing home and the and we've done heck, the first show I ever did was 2006 with the California VA [00:27:00] medical center.
[00:27:00] It was like 16,000 men. And basically they said the guys who were strongest at the front end of this study, 20 years later. They were still alive. The guys who were weakest at the beginning of the 20 year study, they will died. So there is a direct correlation to longevity and overall strength, and it makes sense, right?
[00:27:19] We talk about viruses being strong and resistant. Well, we are strong and resistant when we are strong.
[00:27:25] Dr. Stray-Gunderson: [00:27:25] Yeah, you're absolutely right. Uh, I have two solutions for this problem. One is at when we're 60, we could be blasted off into space where we're waitlist and then it wouldn't matter. But, uh, um, the, uh, the less flippant response is that it's critical to be able to do the workouts.
[00:27:43] And for those of us over 60, uh, BT strong is a perfect way of being able to use easy, doable exercises. To get those positive effects for that sarcopenia that that's getting after us all.
[00:27:58] Carl Lanore: [00:27:58] So Bobby Cooper has a [00:28:00] question that I was going to work in anyway, so this is a good segue. Um, you know, is there a way to know that you've got them at just the right tightness?
[00:28:10] Now be strong, kind of has this covered, right? I mean, first of all, the gauge has a big yellow. Uh, um, danger, a triangle. If you try to go over 450 millimeters of mercury. And I would imagine that that's because now you're getting into an area where you could be occluding the muscle, right?
[00:28:30] Dr. Stray-Gunderson: [00:28:30] Well, there's two, let me yap up a little bit. There's two aspects of this. One is how you, how you place the band on in the first place. And that doesn't have anything to do with the pressure, but what you, what you can see is. And, and my answer is a little nebulous, but it's to put it on firm, not to try not to loose.
[00:28:54] You don't want to be able to have, be able to slip a couple of fingers in between the band and, and yourself. [00:29:00] Um, but you also, you know, don't want to sit there and put your foot on the arm and start, start cranking. It is as hard as you can. Right. And a way to check this is that when you attach the pump.
[00:29:13] And the band is already in place. You'll have something like about 50 millimeters of mercury pressure registered on the gauge
[00:29:20] Carl Lanore: [00:29:20] just from, just from the, just from tightening it on the arm.
[00:29:23] Dr. Stray-Gunderson: [00:29:23] Yeah. And some residual air in, in the, in the bladder of the, of the band. And then what happen, one of our safety features is, um, our pump only goes up to 500 millimeters of mercury and that 500 millimeters of mercury.
[00:29:40] Is really only inflating our bands and causing them to change shape. And they go from being kind of two flat pieces to kind of a cylinder right hand and that, and that cylinder, uh, then impacts the tissue, but it's not really all that much. It's, uh, it's got a limit to how much [00:30:00] pressure can go in there.
[00:30:01] Or how much force it's transmitting into the extremity and therefore up to the maximum of our pump. Uh, it, it, it just, our, our bands are safe
[00:30:12] Carl Lanore: [00:30:12] and, and, and the bladders run vertical to the arm and not. Uh, perpendicular or horizontal, which means that you still have some blood flow and tissue where those bladders aren't really pushing down hard, which to me seems logical so that you can keep, you know, uh, uh, blood, uh, moving however restricted, moving past the band.
[00:30:38] Dr. Stray-Gunderson: [00:30:38] Yeah. So the, those are the features, um, that we improved on. What katsu does. And made our product eminently safe. And, uh, um, as I said earlier, kind of idiot proof.
[00:30:52] Carl Lanore: [00:30:52] I want to take our first commercial break and when we come back, um, I want to tell you what, how I've been using the bands. [00:31:00] And you may end up saying, okay, we thought they could be idiot proof, but Carl has proven us wrong.
[00:31:05] So let's do this. Let's take one quick commercial break. And when we come back, by the way, if you want to try the, uh, be strong bands. There's a special right now, be strong doc training forward slash super hyphen human use. SHR for 10% off. Plus they have six months, same as cash to make it easy for everybody to get these bands and not spend all your Christmas money, uh, just on the band.
[00:31:28] So stay tuned. We'll drive back. So everybody on the show knows me. I overdo everything. Dr. Stray Gunnison, everything. I even overdo overdoing it. My body, my body has all the scars to prove it, surgeries and muscle reattachment and everything else. But you know what? I'll be damned if I'm going to get buried with anything left in this body.
[00:31:51] You know, I want, I want that mortician to look at me and go, wow, this guy got a lot of use out of this body. You know, so, [00:32:00] so, um, Porter Cottrell once told me, um. That Leila Brata told him when he was a young and up and coming pro always leave the gym with a pump. If you train so long that you no longer have a pump, you've trained too long.
[00:32:19] The longer you keep the pump after training, the faster your muscles will grow. And what Lee realized was stretching the facia and thus giving more room for individual. Muscle fibers to fill up with more fluid ultimately leads to a hypertrophic effect. So I thought, leave the gym with a pump. So I've actually been continued after training.
[00:32:46] I've continued to wear my be strong bands for up to four hours after training, and then I take them off, uh, and my, my legs, my calves, my [00:33:00] forearms. Everything is visibly Ficker and stays like that for most of the evening. Am I abusing this technology, dr stray Gundersen?
[00:33:10] Dr. Stray-Gunderson: [00:33:10] Uh, of course not. Carl.
[00:33:13] Um, but. We don't, we don't recommend that. Um, just out of an abundance of caution that the key to an effective session is to get a fatigue signal during the workout. And that's, that's kind of the 90% or so. If you get that fatigue signal, um, you're going to have an effective workout and you're going to get positive adaptations.
[00:33:36] Um. Exactly how long to where I'm after and to maintain that pump. Uh, those things are logical. Uh, I think it makes some sense, um, exactly how much it adds to doing this. I don't know. Um, I would, I would say that some people start wearing them as a fashion statement even when they're not working out.
[00:33:57] So, um, you know, you're [00:34:00] still here and nothing bad's happened doing to, doing all that. So. Um, if you think it helps, it's, it's okay.
[00:34:08] Carl Lanore: [00:34:08] Okay. So we're going to put this question up because someone else may be just tuning in and haven't heard this, and this is a more concise, but Robert David just basically wants to know what's the difference between buying tourniquets or those straps and a system like this?
[00:34:22] So just sum it up comparing them. Yeah.
[00:34:26] Dr. Stray-Gunderson: [00:34:26] So, um. Basically, there's some very expensive systems. And then there's some moderate priced systems. And then there's some inexpensive or cheap systems. And one of the things is you could run down to Walmart and get a Cub scout belt and, and have at it.
[00:34:43] But that's an example of a very rigid, uh, uncontrolled system, which is unlikely to be safe and unlikely to be effective where you get into, um, the very expensive systems. Uh, where they're monitoring things there, they're going to be [00:35:00] safe and they can be made effective, particularly if they're the elastic type.
[00:35:05] Um, and then what, what you do is what we've taken the opportunity to try to find a middle ground. Cause most people can't afford those expensive systems and do something that is, as I was trying to say earlier on, uh, the, uh, relatively, um, educated, uh, web savvy. Uh, uh, adult fitness person, lay person, uh, can use these, could use our be strong bands both safely and effectively.
[00:35:35] And the key components are, one is it's pneumatic, which allows us to control exactly how much pressure is gone where. And the next thing is that it's elastic so that we can accommodate as the muscle changes size. And the third thing is an intermediate width. So we're not covering too much muscle at the same time where we're not putting on a, a rope tourniquet or [00:36:00] something like that.
[00:36:00] Carl Lanore: [00:36:00] Right, right. Which is really helpful. Um, Bobby Cooper has a couple of questions. I, you really did kind of cover this before, but I know people love this, uh, vascular occlusion. Oh. And or, uh, blood flow restriction both seem to increase growth hormone. That, but as you said earlier, that growth hormone response is not exclusively intramuscular.
[00:36:25] You were saying that the liver actually when it, when it gets the signal from the muscle starts to increase IGF one, right?
[00:36:31] Dr. Stray-Gunderson: [00:36:31] Oh yeah. The mechanism, the mechanism for these hormonal releases is the following. Um, a metabolic crisis is created in the working muscle and there are nerve fibers in muscle that.
[00:36:46] Kind of when we're listening to our bodies, that's what we're listening to. Those kinds of, um, those kinds of signals. And so this information goes from the working muscle up into the brain and rattles around in the [00:37:00] brain for awhile. And then it goes to Falmouth and the hypothalamus, and then the, and the hypothalamus gives a command to the pituitary to release growth hormone and a variety of other.
[00:37:12] Factors. The reason I emphasize growth hormone is because that's been well documented, but there's a whole cascade of hormones that are kind of coming out of the pituitary, and then that growth hormone circulates through the whole body. So it has effect on fat cells. It has effects in the liver to create some IGF, one out of the liver, uh, which then in turn, um, stimulates an anabolic response in, in those tissues that need it.
[00:37:42] And then the working muscle itself, they're anabolic hormone receptors, have been upregulated on the cell surface where the growth hormone and testosterone in a variety of other things can then interact and amplify the anabolic signal inside, [00:38:00] inside the working muscle. So there's, um, there's local, there's local effects, and then there's a systemic effect and that systemic effect goes throughout the whole body.
[00:38:11] So. That's why, you know, if you're doing arm curls, you're, and you're doing them standing up, you're getting a little bit of core activation while while you're doing those arm curls just to stabilize yourself. And so those, your core muscles are actually getting a little bit of benefit from those arm curls.
[00:38:29] Carl Lanore: [00:38:29] Here's a highly intelligent question. Is that response in scale with the size of the limb being restricted?
[00:38:37] Dr. Stray-Gunderson: [00:38:37] I, Greg, question. Um, they. More of your body's total muscle mass that you get to give that fatigue signal, the more robust the anabolic Cascade's going to be coming out of the brain. And so that's why we recommend, uh, not just doing, uh, a, uh, you know, working on arms at one time.
[00:39:00] [00:39:00] We generally recommend whole, you
[00:39:03] Carl Lanore: [00:39:03] know, joint. Yeah. Multi joint, like dead lifts and squats and things like that.
[00:39:09] Dr. Stray-Gunderson: [00:39:09] Or high intensity intervals, you know, where you're getting the whole body working. And for those hit intervals, we're also recommending a bands on the arms as well as the legs during that kind of time.
[00:39:22] And so what we're trying to do is we're trying to maximize the percent of total body muscle that's going to be given the brain, the signal, Hey, I, I'm having fatigue down here. You better fix it.
[00:39:33] Carl Lanore: [00:39:33] You know? I don't know why I didn't use bands before, probably because I was afraid of two things.
[00:39:41] Uh, everybody told me just buy tourniquets on Amazon. And I became concerned of both, uh, the possible for throw thrombosis, uh, because you know, if the, if you completely occlude the muscle, depending on certain proteins in your [00:40:00] blood, you could end up with a blood clot that when you take that tourniquet off, it starts moving around your body.
[00:40:04] That was the first thing I was worried about. The other thing I was worried about was, I know from talking to the Japanese scientists all the way back in late 2006 that a complete vascular occlusion could cause necrotic tissue to build up in the muscle about tissue that died, and now it's caught in there.
[00:40:24] And so I, I never had the confidence to go out there and just do this. These bands gave me the confidence because I can see the pressure that I'm putting on each eye. First of all, I know that my left arm and my right arm have exactly the same pressure. That's a little lie. And I'll explain why.
[00:40:41] And then, uh, and then when I looked at the bladders, I went, well, they're running vertical. So there's definitely still some exchange of blood going on in my arm is kind of like a safety valve that gave me greater confidence. Uh, what I said, the reason I said that was good, you respond to that and then I'll tell you why I said that was a lot.
[00:40:59] Yeah.
[00:41:00] [00:41:00] Dr. Stray-Gunderson: [00:41:00] So this is, this gets down to this big, um, reason for elastic VFR. So with elastic VFR, you don't get a ski Mia, you don't get necrosis, you don't get nerve injury and you don't get blood clots. And I can explain all these things. So when w let's, let's say we're doing arm curls, um, and what happens is, um, during rest, the venous side is virtually occluded, particularly if you're using higher pressures.
[00:41:33] But then what happens is when you do that arm curl. The, the forum muscle contraction and uh, and the bicep contraction and actually use up, have a muscle pump that pushes blood past the venous obstruction. Right. And so what you, what you have when you're doing multiple reps is, um, is that you're distending and emptying the veins all the time.
[00:41:59] And this [00:42:00] is actually increasing
[00:42:01] Carl Lanore: [00:42:01] in an actually, in a controlled fashion. Like right. Yeah, that's interesting.
[00:42:07] Dr. Stray-Gunderson: [00:42:07] Yeah. And, and what that does, that, the reason why people can get blood clots is if you have status of blood in the extremity and when you occlude an extremity, that's by definition status.
[00:42:20] Yes. But when you're doing this with elastic, um, blood flow restriction equipment, then what happens is you're actually, you increase the amount of venous flow and the changes in Venus flow, and that actually helps avoid any kind of cloths formation.
[00:42:38] Carl Lanore: [00:42:38] So the reason I said I lied when I said, I know I have the same pressure on my left arm and my right arm is that I tore a, uh, the outer head of my bicep.
[00:42:47] So it, it, it's, it's short. The bicep itself is shorter, which leaves this divid on the outside. So I actually have to go about 50 milligram millimeters of mercury higher on the [00:43:00] left arm in order to achieve the same pump that I do on the right arm to make up for that divid. Okay. That's missing where
[00:43:08] Dr. Stray-Gunderson: [00:43:08] we're all unique.
[00:43:09] We all have little idiosyncrasies that have a over the years. Um. The thing to say is that you know, you've done it right. When you get fatigue, that fatigue signal in the muscle. If at the end of the workout you're saying, Hey, I got some pretty good fatigue here. Uh, I, it got to a point where I even failed at the last set of reps.
[00:43:30] then you know, you've got, you've had a good workout,
[00:43:34] Carl Lanore: [00:43:34] and I know that the idea behind this, as Bobby Cooper says, you know, why. Why a Le less, uh, less joint wear and tear more muscle growth, which is obviously, uh, the mango thing about BFR for those of us who tend to still train heavy, but in a 12 to 15 rep range, I noticed that the bands [00:44:00] actually make me feel stronger.
[00:44:02] And if not a placebo, I'll tell you what it is. It's tethering one side of the muscle. It's giving. A more resilient strength to either the insertion or the end point. I don't know, you know, but I can feel my legs are stronger. I can feel that my arms are stronger with that band on, even though they're super swelled and pumped.
[00:44:26] Dr. Stray-Gunderson: [00:44:26] Yeah. Yeah. You know, it may be that it's, it's kind of bracing. Yes,
[00:44:32] Carl Lanore: [00:44:32] it is. It's like, it's like that tape. It's like these F echo skeletal adaptations that people are putting on to make their muscles stronger. It tethers that side of the muscle for you. Yeah.
[00:44:43] Dr. Stray-Gunderson: [00:44:43] The other thing I, that I, I'd say is that, um, we don't completely go away from normal lifting or normal heavy weight lifting, uh, for those people in power sports.
[00:44:54] We think that's an important component. It's just, it's just that what we're [00:45:00] doing is we're. Decreasing the wear and tear, as Bobby was saying, by doing a half or even a quarter of the normal heavy lifts that we normally do, and we're relying on VFR and lightweights to do most of the
[00:45:14] Carl Lanore: [00:45:14] training, but you still get stronger, right?
[00:45:17] Dr. Stray-Gunderson: [00:45:17] Absolutely. Uh, and, um, we have, we have people who, uh, do nothing but BFR training. And then every so often, let's say once a month. Chest, their one rep max it at something, and those one rep max with heavy weights are going up. Interesting.
[00:45:35] Carl Lanore: [00:45:35] Um, so there is a phenomenon in our population today, uh, and it is peripheral neuropathy, most notably in the legs.
[00:45:44] And for years I said it's not diabetic neuropathy because people who aren't diabetic are developing neuropathy. And we know now that it is, uh, changes in microvasculature. That stopped feeding the nerves a [00:46:00] kind of akin to, if you sat on your leg and watched a movie and then you got up, it was, it fell asleep.
[00:46:06] And that transition from fully falling asleep, which is lack of blood flow to the nerves. To waking up is like what people experience, who have neuropathy. That waking up feeling could be painful. It could be Tingley, it could be numb or any group of in between. And I asked Sean, I wonder if wearing these on your legs and going around all day long, that additional intravascular pressure would actually start to open up that microvascular cha vasculature again.
[00:46:38] Dr. Stray-Gunderson: [00:46:38] I'm not sure about that. But you hit on a really important distinction between rigid systems and elastic systems. So the blood vessels and microvascular that feeds the peripheral nerves is very sensitive to pressure and sometimes something that occludes venous pressure also clues the small arteries and veins in those nerves.
[00:47:00] [00:47:00] And so that's why wide systems. Transmit a lot of pressure into the blood supply in these peripheral nerves and being rigid where you get pressure spikes. It just completely occlude those, that microvascular, those are the things that lead to peripheral neuropathies, um, uh, that that can sometimes happen with BFR.
[00:47:23] Another reason why elastic relatively narrow systems are a better choice.
[00:47:28] Carl Lanore: [00:47:28] So right now my audience can save 10% off. By going to be S, T, R, O, N, G. dot. Training. Forward slur, super hyphen human use. The coupon code SHR plus they have six months, same as cash. Which makes it easy. I, I'm serious.
[00:47:45] I, I ask this question. In all honesty, BFR clearly works when used sensibly and responsibly. BFR clearly works. Why are you not using it if you can build muscle [00:48:00] faster? I mean, people do all sorts of reckless things. They waste money on all sorts of silly supplements that they, they, they, they try ridiculous things.
[00:48:09] To build muscle when there is something right here that actually does work. So why are you not using it? I want to know. I want to hear from my audience. I want you to tell me, yeah, I know it works, but I'm not using it. Fill in the blank. I want to know because it doesn't make any sense to me that people will use drugs that carry high risks.
[00:48:30] They will use silly training and methods that put you at risk of injury. Uh, but, but why not BFR? I want to know why, because there's gotta be an answer to that. Uh, we're gonna take our last commercial break. Stay tuned. We'll be right back. Welcome back. But those of you who, uh, like the doctor seeds products, like the chill pill and the oral BPC supplement, you can get This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it. now and they've got some amazing offers, really, really great [00:49:00] prices.
[00:49:00] I love the chill pill. I take two of them before bed at night, and it just. Takes the edge off and keep in mind that there's studies on dihydro honokiol that show that while it has benzodiazepine like effects, it does not change sleep architecture and it does not affect muscle muscle contract. How force.
[00:49:23] Which is really, really important, but yeah, if you've had too much caffeine and you think, Oh, I'm not going to get to sleep tonight, you take a couple of these chill pills and you who feel the, you feel the edge come right off, but you can get This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it. now and save yourself some money.
[00:49:37] We're talking right now with Dr. James stray Gundersen. We're talking about the be strong. Blood flow restriction system. I highly recommend it. I use it. I'm going to, I'm going to change my physique with this product over the year of 2020 now I can understand that it's going to work, and I said this going into the break, I don't understand why more people don't use it.
[00:49:58] It's not that it's [00:50:00] expensive. People may look at this price, dr stray Gundersen and go, Oh, I've got to lay out a few hundred dollars. But the reality is they're wasting hundreds of dollars every month on supplements that make promises that never, ever produce any results. Right.
[00:50:14] Dr. Stray-Gunderson: [00:50:14] Um, it's, it's right.
[00:50:16] Our, our pricing is right in the ballpark of heart rate monitors, uh, soccer cleats, uh, lots of things that people, Oh, uh, or
[00:50:25] Carl Lanore: [00:50:25] four rings, you know, these things that we buy that, that are important to us, that we put value in here. It is.
[00:50:31] Dr. Stray-Gunderson: [00:50:31] Right, exactly. And, uh. Uh, one of the things you say is that, uh, I think one of the reasons why it hasn't caught on yet is has been because it's been difficult for, uh, a person to implement themselves.
[00:50:47] And that's one of the things that we worked at and in terms of our design and development. Another aspect is that, um, there's been a lot of. Uh, negative comments [00:51:00] associated with the rigid systems and that they can potentially be unsafe, which is, which is true. So, uh, having that elastic component is another thing that, uh, uh, takes a lot of the concern out of, uh, out of the purchase.
[00:51:14] So. And then I think a final thing is, uh, you know, we just haven't done a good enough job in terms of increasing awareness in general, and your show's gonna help a lot with that.
[00:51:24] Carl Lanore: [00:51:24] I, I really think that just complete frankness. I really think that, I mean, I've seen people train with the bands, you know, the, the, the tourniquets and I thought, Oh, you, you've gotta be desperate to build muscle.
[00:51:38] Just train smarter. But the reality is you cannot. Do without these bands, what you can with these bands when a call, when it comes to the response to exercise and muscle growth. And so you need to kind of get over your ego like, Oh yeah, I'm that guy, you know, wearing the bands. Because if [00:52:00] it's like, if you're taking creatine and you're not using these bands, what's wrong with you?
[00:52:04] Like, you know, creatine works, you're taking that this works too, right?
[00:52:10] Dr. Stray-Gunderson: [00:52:10] And, you know, uh, a lot of these things, uh, I, I think they'll catch on. And, uh, um, off we go. I think I, particularly for the, for the novice just starting, uh, whether it's, uh, um. Uh, you know, trying to get to the gym three days a week and doesn't quite know what to do.
[00:52:30] Uh, using the be strong bands is, it is a safe way of easing easing into it and not, not getting injuries from lifting too heavy weights or tweaking your back or dropping a weight on your foot or whatever.
[00:52:43] Carl Lanore: [00:52:43] And here's a great point that Bobby Cooper, who I should just let him ho host the show today.
[00:52:50] He said, you shouldn't be doing cardio without BFR bands on your legs. And really, when you think about it, if you want your cardio to not just produce cardiovascular [00:53:00] adaptation, but increases in muscle size, I mean, using these bands and walking on the treadmill is killer. It's like I, I've said it on the show after, you know, a 30 minute walk with these bands on, you feel like you've been doing lunges for 30 minutes.
[00:53:15] Dr. Stray-Gunderson: [00:53:15] Right? And here's something. Uh, elite runners are actually really strong in those muscles. They're just very lean also. And so for our elite, for our elite runners, um, they use be strong bands and they help. Improve their strength, and actually, as their muscles become stronger and the vasculature improves, they, they actually demand more out of the cardiovascular system.
[00:53:44] So they get an increase in blood delivery and oxygen delivery. And so, uh, there've been a couple studies now showing that. Uh, via true max increases with, uh, with the regular use of, uh, uh, these fans in a [00:54:00] training program. That's
[00:54:01] Carl Lanore: [00:54:01] amazing. That's amazing. And that's not even what they're designed for.
[00:54:05] I mean, that's really amazing. So, uh, do you think that doing whole body routines is probably a more beneficial than going in and doing a three by three part body split with the bands on.
[00:54:19] Dr. Stray-Gunderson: [00:54:19] Uh, I do. Um, but you know, you can do it any way you want. I think the key is to get it, uh, into it and start doing things on a regular basis.
[00:54:28] But most of, most of our athletes and clients end up drifting into doing all four bands at the same time and doing, let's say, five different exercises. Uh, in our form of three sets of 30 reps with 30 seconds rest. And, um, they just get done quicker. And so in 20 minutes, they get a whole body workout and they get a very nice fatigue signal, uh, that's going to initiate that hormonal cascade for them.
[00:54:57] Carl Lanore: [00:54:57] So let's talk about that. So you, you [00:55:00] have a preferred training method when using the bands? We,
[00:55:04] Dr. Stray-Gunderson: [00:55:04] we, we do. Um, but it's just something to get someone started. Um, the real truth is that, uh, I think these things should be incorporated into what, if you're already an avid exerciser, that you should just incorporate these into what it is you're already doing.
[00:55:24] And the way to do that is kind of do your normal routine, but then save about 30 minutes at the end of it to put the bands on and do some more things in that first part, you've established a little bit of fatigue. And then you can really, I think of it as frosting on the cake really, and the benefits of that workout by, uh, doing 20 to 30 minutes at the end.
[00:55:46] Carl Lanore: [00:55:46] That's interesting. I'll try that. I'll start trying that instead of wearing them into the gym and doing the whole workout with them on.
[00:55:53] Dr. Stray-Gunderson: [00:55:53] Yeah. And so, and that gives people co, you know, you don't want to throw the baby out with the bath water, so [00:56:00] if you're going to try to. Change the way somebody does things.
[00:56:03] Start with what they do normally in the first place, and then just add it on at the end. A frosting on the cake.
[00:56:11] Carl Lanore: [00:56:11] Did I read somewhere there's an app that that's available for the beach strong system?
[00:56:15] Dr. Stray-Gunderson: [00:56:15] Yes, there is.
[00:56:16] Carl Lanore: [00:56:16] What does the app provide.
[00:56:18] Dr. Stray-Gunderson: [00:56:18] Uh, at the moment, the app provides a bunch of instructional tips and ways of doing things, and, uh, some basic exercises.
[00:56:27] Uh, but it's right now, it's still in development. And, uh, we hope to have it where it has a library of a whole bunch of different exercises that people can choose from. And, uh, there'll be some more or less canned programs where, you know, it's, it's kinda just, you know. Follow the bouncing ball kind of thing.
[00:56:47] Yeah. But then for those that are, that are more into deciding what it is they do for training, then they can modify these things. Or they can pick and choose from a variety of different [00:57:00] workouts or exercises to make a workout. So
[00:57:03] Carl Lanore: [00:57:03] is there anything that we failed to cover in today's interview?
[00:57:07] Dr. Stray-Gunderson: [00:57:07] Uh, the one thing that I would say to sum up is I would say that, uh, really what we're doing here is we're providing a way for people to improve their performance where they otherwise can't.
[00:57:21] Whether that's an elite athlete that's plateaued. With their workouts, or it's somebody who said dairy who's just starting out but really can't do normal kinds of lifting or running or those sorts of things. And that this is, this is a solution for all types of work, whether it's cardio or whether it's, it's, it's power oriented.
[00:57:44] So
[00:57:44] Carl Lanore: [00:57:44] I wondered if I, if I was a construction worker and I wore BFR bands and I actually ate the way you're supposed to eat, you know, every three hours and didn't go out drinking beer with the guys after work. If I would actually be able to build muscle and just do my job.
[00:57:58] Dr. Stray-Gunderson: [00:57:58] Absolutely.
[00:57:59] Carl Lanore: [00:57:59] Yeah, I [00:58:00] think so.
[00:58:00] I think it's an amazing, it's amazing. I had, I did a show LA last week, uh, uh, with Ronnie Milo, who was with, uh, the renew life RX group, and he was a competitive bodybuilder and he used the BFR, uh, his last competition. He said he only used it on his legs. His legs had never looked that good before on stage.
[00:58:24] Dr. Stray-Gunderson: [00:58:24] You know, really the first place has got started was, uh, the Japanese were using this to get a pump before a bodybuilding comp competition. So that,
[00:58:35] Carl Lanore: [00:58:35] that, that was before they started using it for injuries.
[00:58:39] Dr. Stray-Gunderson: [00:58:39] Yeah. That was like in the 90s and the 80s
[00:58:44] Carl Lanore: [00:58:44] so,
[00:58:44] Dr. Stray-Gunderson: [00:58:44] yeah. It's all about looking good, Carl.
[00:58:47] Carl Lanore: [00:58:47] Yeah. So Bob, I know Bobby works. He works very hard. He says, only if you can handle the pump, I guess, working with them on. So yeah, obviously, listen, this has been a great interview. Uh, I want to tell my audience [00:59:00] again how to get their own V strong BFR system. Probably the safest, most intelligently designed system at an intelligent price.
[00:59:09] Uh, you can actually save 10% off and they also offer a six month, same as cash opportunity. For those of you, it's only a few hundred dollars. Uh, when you, uh, take advantage of the discounts, uh, it'd be strong.training folds. They're super hype and human. Uh, I'll never train without them. I really won't.
[00:59:27] I mean, don't get me wrong. There'll be days where I go to the gym and train just for maybe strength. But then like you just said, those days, I'm going to put them on after and I'm going to do some burnout reps, which I would call burnout reps. just fill the muscle with blood. Really get that pump.
[00:59:45] Yeah, and I'm going to continue to wear them after the gym, so we'll see if I end up with my limbs falling off at some point in my life, but I like it. I feel that I sit at my desk and I extend my my legs and I lock my quads out a couple of times and the [01:00:00] pump is right back in there again. You know, I sit here and I flex my biceps and I flex my triceps with them on and the P, I feel like I just walked out of the gym.
[01:00:08] The pump comes right back. And the fact that I lose the pump a little bit speaks to the fact that this is not vascular occlusion, because if it was vascular occlusion, if it was rigid, I wouldn't lose the pump by sitting here for a while.
[01:00:22] Dr. Stray-Gunderson: [01:00:22] Right. So you can always check your pump era. Check your pulse.
[01:00:26] Carl Lanore: [01:00:26] Yes. Well, why wait, wait, talk about that. Why do you mean check your pulse.
[01:00:29] Dr. Stray-Gunderson: [01:00:29] Well. So let's say you have the bands on for a long time, and if you have any doubt at all about whether or not a, you've included,
[01:00:36] Carl Lanore: [01:00:36] just feel it, feel, Oh, if you can't, if you can't feel your pulse, then it's probably occlusion, isn't it?
[01:00:42] Yeah.
[01:00:42] Dr. Stray-Gunderson: [01:00:42] Now the, the only thing is, is that some people aren't very good at feeling their pulses, but, um. You know, so they may be confused when they can't feel it,
[01:00:51] Carl Lanore: [01:00:51] but dead. I've been doing this whole interview. I'm dead. I look thanks for being on the show today.
[01:00:59] Dr. Stray-Gunderson: [01:00:59] Yeah, I'm [01:01:00] happy to do it. No, I was, it was fun.
[01:01:02] Thanks for being a sponsor also. Yup.
[01:01:05] Carl Lanore: [01:01:05] Okay. All right. And we'll see everybody tomorrow with the blueprint power hour. Don't forget. To tune in for that with the coach Rob ruggish. And then, uh, uh, Wednesday we have a special pep talk. Uh, Ryan Smith from TaylorMade is coming on and we're going to be talking about a new peptide that not only may improve fat loss in the face of the standard American diet, but I found out some information through dr seeds that it may actually increase the anabolic response.
[01:01:34] And this is a peptide nobody is talking about. Of course you'd expect to hear about it here first. And then everybody will be talking about it, acting like they are the ones that found it first. So tune in for the pep talk at a special time at one o'clock on Wednesday. And then of course, after that, we eat a lot of protein for a few days and stay around with family and, uh, just enjoy ourselves.
[01:01:55] Before we get back to work, I will see everybody tomorrow. Thank you for watching super human [01:02:00] radio and listening today.
