[00:00:00] Carl Lanore: [00:00:00] hey, Hey, welcome back to another episode of super human radio. Today is September 28th and we have a really good show today. Really, really, really, really good show. Um, we've been talking about mitochondria forever, and those of you who have been fans of the show for a long time, know that well, he is a missing link and it's fascinating and it's probably a gateway to a lot of other exciting stuff to come.

[00:00:25] Uh, and then later in the show, we're going to be talking about CBD being used in sports, nutrition. What is it doing there? Uh, so you want to stay tuned for that as well. Uh, before we get started, we have to thank our title sponsor legendary foods. If you are a low carb, low sugar, high protein person, maybe kedo, really, if protein is important and keeping your carbs down.

[00:00:50] And sugar consumption down is important to you. Then you'll want to go to eat legendary.com because they have the best snacks that will keep you in your lane. [00:01:00] Use the code SHR 10 to receive 10% off your entire purchase and be sure to check out the tasty pastry. It's a pop tart. Yes, and it has less than one gram of sugar and nine grams of high leucine, high quality protein.

[00:01:16] Put them in your kids' lunch boxes. They won't know that they're good for them. They'll just think it's popped. Oh, mom, give me a pop tart. They're wonderful. Wonderful. You have to check them out. Also want to announced that those of you who are fans of the show, that today is my full first full week with zero caffeine.

[00:01:31] This is amazing for me and I don't feel like I need it. And we'll talk more about that at the end of the show. So you'll want to stay tuned for that as well. Uh, welcome to the show dr. Joe Bauer. How are you?

[00:01:45] Dr. Joe Bauer, Ph. D.: [00:01:45] Thanks. Carol.

[00:01:46] Carl Lanore: [00:01:46] Happy to be here. Yeah. Yeah. This will be, this is going to be fun. So, um, before we talk about your research, uh, on the mitochondria, let's talk about why, what, what, what research preceded this, that you will [00:02:00] kind of led down this path to, to look at this.

[00:02:03] Dr. Joe Bauer, Ph. D.: [00:02:03] Yeah, well, it's kind of, you know, in my mind been the elephant in the room for a while, and that we've all been interested in NAD and how these different supplements might be beneficial and different than a DNA dependent enzymes might work. But we've known that a lot of the key effects of an ID take place inside the mitochondria.

[00:02:18] And it's just never been figured out exactly how it gets in there. And so we've been interested in this. Question on a fundamental level for awhile. Um, we've done some preceding studies where we had used isotopic tracers to show that basically we could create NAD in the site. It's all with isotopic labels all around the molecule.

[00:02:36] So we could tell that it was made in the cytosol and then find that same molecule inside the mitochondria. And so, so it's been a couple of years now, since we first knew that the mitochondria we're taking an 18 from the cytosol, um, we just still didn't know how. And so this, this recent paper is really that discovery of what it is mechanistically, what is the protein that actually gets the NAD into the mitochondria?

[00:02:57] Carl Lanore: [00:02:57] See, and this is, this is an important distinction in and of [00:03:00] itself because, um, So, I mean, I injected NAD plus 25 milligrams, four days a week. And I did that for probably about eight months. I really recently just took off. I ran out and I didn't feel like ordering. And so, but you know, I, I really didn't notice a whole lot.

[00:03:17] I can't say that. I experienced the energy that people speak of, but I'm a naturally energetic guy. I'm a, I'm a pretty energy, 60, 62 year old. So maybe, you know, only those who are deficient noticing something. And I don't notice anything. We see this a lot in yeah. Types of supplementation research where one group, it's a great response.

[00:03:37] The other group notices nothing. And then when they look deeper, they go, that group was efficient. So, um, but there are, there were so many companies out there right now, Hawking. Nicotine and my D Ribos and it's patented and it's expensive. I think , um, I think , maybe it's not offensive, but I there's a company that owns it.

[00:03:59] Oh, [00:04:00] chroma decks, uh, owns the patent on it and, and like it's expensive and people down in this stuff like, Oh, it's going to make me live longer and maybe not. Right. I mean, if the transporter. He's taken out of the equation. Maybe the model maybe look the mean has the capacity to make its own insulin in an emergency.

[00:04:20] Maybe the mitochondria is like that. Maybe the mitochondria can bio synthesize and a D plus, but not indefinitely. D like, do you think that people who are Downing tons and tons of these supplements may not be seeing the benefits because they have a malfunctioning transportation transport system. So that, I

[00:04:41] Dr. Joe Bauer, Ph. D.: [00:04:41] mean, I suspect honestly how fundamental it is to get NAD into the mitochondria that if this transporter system was, was really malfunctioning, you would have an overt mitochondrial disorder.

[00:04:51] So I think it's more likely that the people that really have this system malfunctioning or some of these patients that do exist that have mitochondrial disorders that just have an unknown origin. [00:05:00] And you know, that maybe this will fill in the blanks for a few of those of those patients. Yeah. The more fundamental question of whether, whether we have enough NAD in the first place, I think is really important, right?

[00:05:09] Whether the people that do see benefits are really only the ones that happen to be deficient in the first place. There's always this question of how did your body choose how much NAD you would have by default. And certainly you can make it within each of your cells, including, you know, the brain does make its own Nat.

[00:05:24] Uh, and so there's this fundamental question of what, why would there be a mismatch between how much you have and how much you

[00:05:30] Carl Lanore: [00:05:30] right, right.

[00:05:32] Dr. Joe Bauer, Ph. D.: [00:05:32] In most models that that does seem to be the case, right? I mean, a lot of the basis for why these supplements are selling so well, is that there have been mouse studies where in different conditions, boosting NAD levels helps a lot.

[00:05:42] You know, it's a really an open question in most cases, how well that's going to translate into humans and, you know, people that are jumping out ahead of, I think that the science in that sense, if they, you know, if they feel confident that it's going to help them. Um, but there's certainly a possibility from the network and it's, and it's going to be important to have real clinical trials where we see if there are [00:06:00] benefits, but if it.

[00:06:01] Yeah, the real question of whether, whether it depends and you're having a deficiency for some reason to see a benefit, I think is a really important thing to consider. And in fact, we've seen that in mice, that if we take young, healthy mice, we have a lot of trouble showing that there's any benefit. To boosting NAD levels through the roof and these young, healthy animals.

[00:06:19] Right? You can find lots of scenarios where you have an older mouse or a sick mouse where it seems to help. And it may well be the same thing for humans.

[00:06:26] Carl Lanore: [00:06:26] So, you know, NAD is a downstream metabolite of just good old fashioned nicotinic acid. I mean, if you have adequate amounts of niacin in your diet, theoretically, you should have the building blocks to make your own NAD.

[00:06:39] In fact, I use de Ribos now as, since I've kicked caffeine, I've had to find some. Creative ways to create a pre-workout and, and D ribosome is a fantastic sugar, specifically used by muscle, but especially by the heart and the heart can be the limiting, the limiting [00:07:00] factor in being able to train hard, because there's a negative feedback loop that keeps you from killing yourself.

[00:07:04] So you can't push as hard, but, um, if I'm taking Ribos and, and. Nicotinic acid. I have to believe that my body has what it needs. It needs to synthesize a NAD plus, am I wrong?

[00:07:18] Dr. Joe Bauer, Ph. D.: [00:07:18] No, no. That certainly gives you a body of the components. I mean, anybody can make the right bus as well. Right? So the, the, the, the pentose phosphate pathway is a different alternative pathway to glycolysis.

[00:07:27] The peoples' goes through that produces Ribos. Um, you know, and so the, the argument that all of these things is that something must be going a little bit wrong. Sometimes it takes a lot of ATP. It's a lot of energy for the cell to generate nap. And so one argument in favor of something like nicotine and might Rob aside, is that it enters this synthetic pathway farther downstream when you spare some of that requirement for extra energy input to make it.

[00:07:49] And so maybe if you take a tissue, that's under a lot of energetic stress, it's not very capable of regenerating NAD pool. And that would, that would give it a simpler path.

[00:07:57] Carl Lanore: [00:07:57] Yeah. That makes sense. That does make sense. So let's [00:08:00] talk about this gene that you discovered it's called L S L C

[00:08:06] Yes. Tell us about it.

[00:08:09] Dr. Joe Bauer, Ph. D.: [00:08:09] Well, first of all, when it has a name like that, you know, that's usually a sign that there's is going to be interesting, cause nothing was known about it. Right. It's been given a systematic name where it's just named after the transporter family, that it's a member of. Um, and pretty much nothing else.

[00:08:22] The order it was discovered in this 51. Right. So, so this is a transporter that's been around for awhile. They've been a couple of screens that have suggested it might be important for mitochondrial function, but just in terms of large genome-wide sets where, you know, lots of things were in there and it doesn't really stood out.

[00:08:39] Um, other than in some recent screens for essential genes, uh, if you really, you know, synthesize all the data together and look, it does start to pop out as one of the genes that is labeled as being in the mitochondria, no known function. And it really is essential.

[00:08:54] Carl Lanore: [00:08:54] Oh, wow. So there was no, it's not like it does some other things.

[00:08:58] And now you found out it does this. There was no [00:09:00] known function for this gene. Right? Wow.

[00:09:03] Dr. Joe Bauer, Ph. D.: [00:09:03] Since it was out, there was somebody had seen it.

[00:09:06] Carl Lanore: [00:09:06] I didn't know. I didn't know. There were genes that we still didn't know what they did. That's pretty cool actually.

[00:09:11] Dr. Joe Bauer, Ph. D.: [00:09:11] Oh, there's, there's lots of them still out there if given these systematic names and it tends to fool people, you know, that they're described and they're listed in reports, but there many of them just have no idea what actually happens.

[00:09:22] Carl Lanore: [00:09:22] That's that's fascinating. So, um, how does it, so, so we know a lot about membranes and transportation is, um, is I know there's two membranes on a mitochondria, right? The outer, and then there's an inner membrane. Is this gene responsible for producing an enzyme that then takes the NAD plus across both of these membranes into a specific area?

[00:09:46] Or just once it gets it into the mitochondria, the mitochondria knows what to do with it.

[00:09:50] Dr. Joe Bauer, Ph. D.: [00:09:50] Well, so there are larger openings on the outer membrane. It's a little bit easier for things to get back and forth. This gene and codes approaching the inserts into the inner membrane protein and provides a [00:10:00] pathway for the NAD to make it inside the matrix.

[00:10:02] Carl Lanore: [00:10:02] Okay. Okay. And then once it's in that matrix, where does it go?

[00:10:08] Dr. Joe Bauer, Ph. D.: [00:10:08] Um, it's floating around. So it's actually the communication between the Krebs cycle and the electron transport chain. So if you're, you know, if you're familiar with medical device.

[00:10:16] Carl Lanore: [00:10:16] Sure. So it actually, it actually flips a switch on ATP production.

[00:10:20] You're saying this, this turns it up or doesn't assist at all.

[00:10:25] Dr. Joe Bauer, Ph. D.: [00:10:25] No, this, this does this. So this, this is actually the molecule that's involved in the, you know, as the Krebs cycle turns. So as you're turning through your acetyl-CoA in the mitochondria, which is coming from carbohydrate or fat or whatever source of energy you have, you know, as you turn through that release carbon dioxide, the whole way around you're generating NAD H from NAD.

[00:10:43] So you're converting it to its high energy form that molecule donates the electrons that it's picked up to complex one of the electron transport chain. So it is the what's communicating from the biochemical reactions to the actual electron transport chain that generates the ATP in the mitochondria.

[00:10:59] Carl Lanore: [00:10:59] Now

[00:11:00] [00:10:59] Dr. Joe Bauer, Ph. D.: [00:10:59] we,

[00:11:01] Carl Lanore: [00:11:01] sorry, I didn't mean to cut you off. I'm a little add. So we, we, we now know that taking too much, uh, of an antioxidant. Uh, because it reduces stress on the mitochondria actually reduces adaptation, desired adaptations to exercise. For instance, could it be possible that making the job too easy, uh, for the mitochondria keeps it from adapting and that, that a reduction in availability of NAD plus may actually make a more robust, stronger mitochondria.

[00:11:37] Dr. Joe Bauer, Ph. D.: [00:11:37] I mean, it is. You know, theoretically possible. We don't, we don't really know yet, but what I will say is that in the muscle, at least when you exercise, one of the responses is to generate more NAD. So you got to regulate some of the biosynthetic genes and you increase the NAD content that muscle over time as you exercise.

[00:11:52] So we tend to see it as at least an adaptive mechanism that would promote physical ability. Although we can't rule out that you might be right, that if [00:12:00] you've given the NAD. In advance. It may be that you don't get the full adoptive response because you already have the NAD and, you know, don't put as much stress on the system.

[00:12:09] Carl Lanore: [00:12:09] Does, does this, does this, is this gene affected in any way? Like by an epigenetic effect, in that we see this gene doing less and less as we age, do we have a link to aging and function of this gene?

[00:12:26] Dr. Joe Bauer, Ph. D.: [00:12:26] Uh, we don't have a link to aging yet. I mean, we certainly see less than a D in aged tissues and less than needed in the mitochondria of aged tissues in some cases.

[00:12:34] Um, you know, so, so this whole system, you know, it's part of the aging process, but this particular gene actually doesn't jump out very often, uh, in terms of something that's being changed at the transcriptional level. So probably it doesn't seem like there's a major mode of epigenetic regulation. And what we would hypothesize is that it's probably regulated translationally.

[00:12:53] So the activity of the protein is probably responding to things much more than the gene expression.

[00:12:58] Carl Lanore: [00:12:58] Are you, are you familiar [00:13:00] with senescent cells?

[00:13:02] Dr. Joe Bauer, Ph. D.: [00:13:02] Yes.

[00:13:03] Carl Lanore: [00:13:03] Do senescent cells have malfunctioning, a mitochondria? Do they have functioning mitochondria?

[00:13:10] Dr. Joe Bauer, Ph. D.: [00:13:10] Um, they have malfunctioning mitochondria in many cases and that they're producing more reactive oxygen species and things.

[00:13:16] Um, they still do have their fundamental function, um, that they can produce ATP.

[00:13:21] Carl Lanore: [00:13:21] Do they do, they still rely on NAD plus for anything, once they are senescent, they do. Huh?

[00:13:28] Dr. Joe Bauer, Ph. D.: [00:13:28] They do. So, so I mean, so the mitochondria are still functioning there and there's still reactions going on in the, in the cytosol and then the nucleus that require NAD so that you, you basically can't have a living cell without NAD.

[00:13:39] Carl Lanore: [00:13:39] Interesting. Interesting. Do you see a reduction in, Oh, well you don't know. Cause you just discovered this. I'm wondering if there's a reduction in. The transporter function in senescent cells versus quiescent cells, because then th that, that could speak to why aging, um, Yeah, we, we know [00:14:00] that we know about senescent cells.

[00:14:01] Now we know about the accumulation of senescent cells and tissue. It could, it could possibly be that it's the senescent cells that are, down-regulating the function of this gene and the, and the transport of NAD plus into, into the mitochondria. But did you guys have to look into that now, right now that you did that, that would be, I mean, that would be fascinating because.

[00:14:21] Like, uh, a lot of us older guys who are using things like rap miacin rap, uh, logs, you know, once a week, six milligrams, I'm that guy. And, uh, you know, I notice since I started doing it, I noticed great changes in my energy also. Uh, and also some mountains, some maladies that have I've developed as I age, they seem to like, like, Oh my God, this isn't a placebo like you have week.

[00:14:43] Do I notice that it feels better? It's functioning better. And I'm just wondering if. Senescent cells could be the reason that this, uh, that this gene starts to produce or transport produce less. And there's less transport across the membrane. That, that, that would be an [00:15:00] interesting thing to find out. Um, yeah.

[00:15:02] Yeah.

[00:15:03] Dr. Joe Bauer, Ph. D.: [00:15:03] Well, so one of the fundamental things in us that cells are doing right, it's producing, what's called the SAS senescence associated secretary of response. So they are releasing all kinds of inflammatory proteins and the surrounding environment. Then they could, you know, there could well be because of a change in the activity of this protein, through some inflammatory signaling cascade, you know, even if it's not fundamentally changed within the senescent cells themselves and rapamycin definitely does module modify that response down, regulate some of the inflammatory factors.

[00:15:30] Carl Lanore: [00:15:30] Well, and, and interestingly enough, I was just communicating with dr. McKell black is Colone. He's been on the show numerous times. Do you know who he is? He's the guy who wrote the rebuttal paper. Okay, great. Uh, so, and I, and he, I said, Misha, I said, do I have to worry about, um, no, I said, Misha, how does a wrap myosin yeah.

[00:15:47] Effect, uh, um, my, uh, my Tophat G and he says it actually increases my top of G. And so that was a good thing because my topic three means that the organelle is cleaning itself up more [00:16:00] regularly, and it's less likely to develop metabolic debris and all that sort of stuff. So, I mean, it's interesting to find out if getting rid of senescent cells changes the landscape of this transporter.

[00:16:10] That would be fascinating to me. Um, but let's talk a little bit about epigenetics for a second. Is there any evidence, or even though you may not have had to do the study, do you see anything that correlates with other. Uh, gene functions that you've looked at that would indicate that there may be some epigenetic triggers, uh, at work on this particular gene.

[00:16:32] Dr. Joe Bauer, Ph. D.: [00:16:32] No, I mean, so certainly it's, it's a mitochondrial gene and, you know, they tend to move in unison, right? There's, there's a few transcription factors that tend to control most of the mitochondrial genes. So certainly it's going to be epigenetically regulated. You know, but the level of things like PGC one alpha, which is called the master regulator of mitochondrial biogenesis, and that will trigger epigenetic changes at many different mitochondrial genes, including this one and up or down regulate them.

[00:16:56] So certainly expect that to play a role in its expression. Um, [00:17:00] But I have to say we haven't, we haven't seen a signature of this gene jumping out of line by itself in any of the things that we've looked at, which is really why we are a little more focused on the regulation at the level of the protein right now,

[00:17:11] Carl Lanore: [00:17:11] disease States.

[00:17:12] Uh, do you think this research could potentially have an effect on if we recognize that? Oh, we can. Let's say we find a drug therapy that increases the function of this gene and we see more, uh, transport of NAD plus into. Uh, the mitochondria, what diseases depend on that process?

[00:17:32] Dr. Joe Bauer, Ph. D.: [00:17:32] Well, I think, um, I mean, there's a few different ones.

[00:17:34] I mean, obviously it's very speculative at this point, but for sure, you know, in cancer, there are different tumors that prefer one mode of metabolism or the other, right. That they tend to be more glycolytic or more off state dependent on mitochondria. And so being able to manipulate the spreading either do inhibit or activate it, you may well be able to push the tumor in the direction that doesn't like, you know, and, and maybe have a therapeutic effect in different cancer models.

[00:17:54] Um, There's been an observation that NAD levels are depleted in heart failure. And [00:18:00] we've actually done some work showing that the, as the heart is failing from it with low NAD, it tends to accumulate most of the remaining remaining NAD in the mitochondria and the halflife even there, it seems to extend a little bit as the NAD levels are falling.

[00:18:13] So it's, it's preserving it as well as it can. So I think there's certainly a possibility that boosting NAD levels. You know, in the mitochondria during heart failure would be therapeutic and maybe shield DNA deal a little bit. So many of the enzymes that breakdown NAD are in the cytosol or the nucleus and not present in the mitochondria.

[00:18:30] And so by pushing more of it in there, you may spare it for a lot longer in conditions where it's being depleted.

[00:18:35] Carl Lanore: [00:18:35] What about muscular muscular dystrophy? That's also associated associated with the model control mitochondrial dysfunction. Also, I just forgot how to talk. Is it, is it muscular dystrophy? One of those.

[00:18:48] Dr. Joe Bauer, Ph. D.: [00:18:48] Yeah. So, so in muscular dystrophy, there is some evidence now in most models, again, that it actually has a pretty good therapeutic effect. When you set them up with nicotinamide, riboside a mouse model of muscular dystrophy does much better. [00:19:00] The muscles regenerate better and get bigger. And the mitochondria function better.

[00:19:03] Um, so that that's certainly an area of interest for human studies and it hasn't been proven in humans at this point. Uh, and it's, you know, it's a very difficult and expensive proposition.

[00:19:12] Carl Lanore: [00:19:12] Yeah.

[00:19:13] Dr. Joe Bauer, Ph. D.: [00:19:13] Uh, there's a more recent study on, um, um, different mitochondria myopathy, another muscle muscle wasting disorder, but that is known to be caused by mitochondrial dysfunction in humans where niacin was recently shown it to be therapeutic.

[00:19:25] Carl Lanore: [00:19:25] So that there's that downstream yet downstream metabolite. Yeah. You know, um, Dr. Steven Sinatra had the Sinatra protocol for heart failure about 12, 14 years ago. And he suggested taking magnesium, uh acetylcarnitine D Ribos cocuten and niacin. And now he was a heart surgeon who spent his career cracking.

[00:19:53] You know, uh, chest open and, and, and he went to this and he, he said he never had a replacement of the heart, [00:20:00] uh, or do surgery on another heart. He said he saved thousands and thousands of heart failure patients. And when you think about that, you know, if they're niacin, you know, uh, I mean, obviously a seat, a local, uh, uh, Cielo carnitine is shown to make the mitochondria prefer.

[00:20:17] Um, I don't want to say fats, a substrate effect, triglycerides as a source of, of energy. And so there's that because if the mitochondria is malfunctioning and it's not using glucose, then you're in trouble. But I mean, it's the niacin, it's the, it's the  I mean, they're right there. And so the body probably upregulates the production of NAD plus.

[00:20:40] As part of

[00:20:40] Dr. Joe Bauer, Ph. D.: [00:20:40] it. Yeah. I mean, in a theoretical sense, you can certainly link in the current team there too, because if there is mitochondrial dysfunction, you would get with NAD deficiency, you tend to build up fats and get off. So those them as quickly, and the carnitine conjugated fats can then drift out of the mitochondria in some cases into the blood.

[00:20:54] So you can be permanently inefficient.

[00:20:56] Carl Lanore: [00:20:56] And, and I, and I actually think, um, [00:21:00] if it helps someone at the precipice of heart failure, what could it do for athletes? You know, I remember reading a study 20 something years ago that showed that there's a negative feedback loop. I alluded to it at the beginning of the show.

[00:21:16] There's a negative feedback gloop that actually keeps you from driving yourself into a heart attack. And so the ability of your heart to work hard talks to the brain. And when you start nearing that threshold, You become muscles fatigue occurs that it's, you know, it's part of the neurological process of putting the brakes on and.

[00:21:38] If you took these supplements that are helping heart failure patients before you went for a bike ride or, you know, a high intensity interval, you'll be able to train harder. I guarantee it because if it can save someone whose heart is failing, then think we couldn't do what it could do for you when you're pushing your heart as hard as you can.

[00:21:57] I mean, co co co Q 10, [00:22:00] acetylcarnitine magnesium. Niacin and de Ribos those five things. Those, somebody should come out with a pre-workout that just uses those and no, no caffeine at all. Um, we're going to take our first commercial break. And when we come back, I've got lots of more questions we're talking with dr.

[00:22:15] Joe Bauer. Right now, this is a fascinating discovery, and I predict it's going to be a lot of research now that you have now, now that you have this target. I would imagine that you're, you're just kind of like a kid in a candy shop. Like we could check this, we could do this. I want to talk about literally testing, uh, for this, uh, this function to see if before people put a lot of hope in this, maybe they, you can get some sort of test to determine that this is in fact the problem that they have.

[00:22:43] Okay, we'll talk about that. When we come back, stay to finally meet

[00:22:52] welcome back. We're talking with dr. Joe Bauer. We're talking about a recent study that was published, [00:23:00] looking at the, the ability to transport NAD plus across the membrane of the mitochondria into the mitochondria. This is a very important distinction because for a long time, everybody thought. That the mitochondria, how to make the NAD plus in order for it to be of any good.

[00:23:18] And the fact that this transporter exists tells us that it's not necessarily true. Um, so is there a, is there a way to test for this, like, like the protein that's made? I would imagine you could test the levels of this protein, right?

[00:23:33] Dr. Joe Bauer, Ph. D.: [00:23:33] Yeah. No, certainly a simple, so I mean, if the, you know, if you're talking about, um, something that's mass market for humans, right.

[00:23:39] Carl Lanore: [00:23:39] No, that's, that's, that's it's up the road, but I mean, you could, like, you could theoretically test if somebody came in with chronic fatigue, um, there will be a point in time where they would be able to do a, you know, a blood ass and say, Oh, you know, you're, uh, what's the name of the protein that this gene produces?

[00:23:57] Dr. Joe Bauer, Ph. D.: [00:23:57] Um, I mean, you referred to it either as [00:24:00] Encarta one or SLC 25 51, the same as the gene.

[00:24:03] Carl Lanore: [00:24:03] Oh. So the protein is called the same thing as LC.

[00:24:07] Dr. Joe Bauer, Ph. D.: [00:24:07] Yeah. I mean, it's got, it's got two names in the literature. So either they're the same as the gene name or , but they're both.

[00:24:15] Carl Lanore: [00:24:15] So, so a doctor could go, Oh my goodness, your M card one is so low.

[00:24:18] Now we know we need to sub supplement with NAD plus or injections, or, you know, even by then maybe there'll be drug therapies to improve the function of this, uh, of this increase, this protein,

[00:24:31] Dr. Joe Bauer, Ph. D.: [00:24:31] right. No, absolutely. I mean, it's a little tricky when you're dealing with blood, right. Because there's no matter country and the wet blood says, so you've got it.

[00:24:38] And there's nothing in the plasma that's going to indicate anything. So you have to isolate white blood cells, but then yeah, you can absolutely look for levels of the protein and you could go all out and isolate enough white blood cells to then isolate mitochondria and actually directly measure DNAD and see if they're really deficient.

[00:24:53] And it turns out NADH is autofluorescence so. There's a little bit of a high background, so there'll be a bit of an engineering problem [00:25:00] involved. We could probably get to the point where you could do, um, you know, flow the cells through a flow cytometer and look for autofluorescence from one IDH in the mitochondria.

[00:25:08] And, and have you diagnosed, whether they're, at least there was a problem getting into the, in there, you know, without necessarily knowing whether it's this protein,

[00:25:14] Carl Lanore: [00:25:14] do you think of things like exercise? You know, I I've said on the show for years that if I had cancer, I'd still fare better. If I kept exercising, like no matter what, no matter what disease state you get, except obviously if it's some neurological disease where you can't, you know, motor function is, but even then trying to push yourself to move more, probably would keep you functional.

[00:25:39] My sister died from Parkinson's disease. When I lived out in Arizona with her, I used to take it to the gym and she was progressing. So, you know, even with a disease like that, she was getting stronger week to week. And so, uh, I mean, Do you think exercise affects this, uh, this gene?

[00:26:00] [00:26:00] Dr. Joe Bauer, Ph. D.: [00:26:00] Um, I mean, we don't, we don't have direct evidence again for the, for the gene expression, changing and exercise, but I think it stands to reason for sure.

[00:26:08] Um, you really, you need to boost mitochondria function and exercise, and you do upregulate NAD synthesis as a response to exercise and the total tissue, any of these higher. Um, so that's, that's a question that we should be answering in the next month or so, uh, w whether exercise really boosts affinity in the mitochondria and whether it affects expression of this gene, that certainly makes sense.

[00:26:27] Um, and that's certainly consistent with, you know, with everything. We've seen on aging in general, that exercise seems to always be beneficial unless you cause an injury, right? I mean, you see that with, with older people exercising, if you don't break your hip, you know, you're in much better shape for exercising, obviously it's, it becomes a really bad thing.

[00:26:43] And partly because you become immobile for so long, if you do sustain an injury that it's the complete opposite of exercise, you're basically doing nothing for weeks and weeks, and that can have really detrimental effects.

[00:26:53] Carl Lanore: [00:26:53] Do you know who thinks exercise is a bad idea? You know who Aubrey de grey is. He wrote the [00:27:00] mitochondrial theory of,

[00:27:04] do you know him personally? Yeah. Okay. So I met him here in Louisville, Kentucky. He was here for some sort of, uh, program. And so I asked them to come on the show. And so he came on the show, it was by phone. We weren't doing video back then. This is probably about nine years ago, eight years ago, we were talking about exercise.

[00:27:22] He says, you know, exercise is a horrible idea. He said, all you're doing is spinning off more oxidative stress. You said, you know, and, and, and, and we joked, you know, he likes his pints, you know, he loves to drink beer. And so, and, and I said, wow. I said, you know, I think I want to keep exercising. And he said, well, you should.

[00:27:39] Yeah. So that's what you want to do. He said, but according to the research, You're just loading your body up with oxidative stress that it's just not necessary. And I, you know, I just thought that was so monolithic of a view on what exercise does. You know what I mean? It was just funny. Yeah,

[00:27:55] Dr. Joe Bauer, Ph. D.: [00:27:55] no, no. I mean the, you know, there's certainly different, different viewpoints out there, and there is some evidence that, [00:28:00] you know, in low in rodents, for instance, if you extend life span with exercise, you extend the average life span, but not the maximum life span.

[00:28:07] And with calorie restriction, sometimes you can extend the maximum life span. And so there's, there's this argument that exercise isn't maybe fundamentally affecting aging as much as some of the other pathways people study. In fact, there was a rat study where they exercise one group and calibrate restricted another group just to match body weights.

[00:28:27] And in that scenario, so you get two rats of the same body weight, the ones that didn't exercise lived longer. And I think that that sort of feels these types of discussions you would have with, with Aubrey. Um, But currently in humans. Yeah. Strong correlation between health and exercise.

[00:28:40] Carl Lanore: [00:28:40] So, so, so, you know, and, and, and I think I said this to you off air, you know, the human body is so complex exercises that artificial replacement for labor, we used to work.

[00:28:52] We used to hunt and gather and lift and build, and even up through, you know, [00:29:00] the 17, 18 hundreds. Uh, we still we're predominantly a labor based population. And then everything shifted in the 19 hundreds. And we started to become office workers and computers. And now we sit for eight to 10 hours a day where we used to be mobile and ambulate for eight to 10 hours a day.

[00:29:19] And so I think that we will, we have to be careful of is sometimes when they do studies on exercise. Uh there's first of all, there's not a balance on what is considered cardiovascular. And conditioning exercise and muscle building exercise. Uh, the Annabelle is, is, is very ignored. The value of muscle is very, very good Nord.

[00:29:41] Um, we see studies out of, uh, places like, uh, the veterans administration, California sick over 60,000 men. They followed for 20 years and they gave them a leg press and a grip strength at the beginning of the study. And then they [00:30:00] tested these men every five years moving forward for 20 years and the, and who were the strongest at the beginning of this study and continue to maintain their strength, the ones who lived and the men who were the weakest and continue to get weaker were the men who died.

[00:30:16] And, you know, there's a reason that the strong survivors is a, is a, is a true statement that we still carry on today. Yeah. Part of it was because you could defend yourself, you can hunt, you can fish, but from an evolutionary perspective, those are all key components of evolution that, and, and, and offspring, right?

[00:30:35] Like, like I tell people all the time, the day your libido is going, you need to find out what's wrong with you. Because that's your only job here on the planet is to have sex and make offspring. And if that's not working your body's on the wrong side of the curve, now you're going, you're going to your grave now.

[00:30:49] Um, but I think some of these studies, when they do exercise studies and they put a rat on a wheel and they make them run some, some ridiculous amount of time, you know, I do, I, [00:31:00] there's more to, to exercise and, and, and there's also more to muscle building. Uh, then is, is, uh, given any credit. I think when they do those types of research papers, this is my assumption because building muscle, you know, those of us who train hard and intensely, we have larger mitochondria and we have more mitochondria per, per muscle fiber.

[00:31:24] And that, you know, that's gotta mean something, right? Yeah.

[00:31:27] Dr. Joe Bauer, Ph. D.: [00:31:27] Well, and I, you know, I think. Free radicals sometimes get a bad rap too, in that, you know, obviously way too many of them is a bad thing, but you know, you need a certain level of free radicals and oxidative damage to function normally. And to think, you know, the level that you get with exercise you could argue is maybe in that functional range where it is promoting beneficial, adaptive responses, you know, punching, it might be the best side.

[00:31:48] Carl Lanore: [00:31:48] ROS is responsible for killing tumor cells. You know, everybody wants to, Oh, you just got to squash that ROS, you know, it's. In fact it's thought that one of the ways IGF [00:32:00] one, uh, helps cancer cells progress is not just from the growth promoting side of it, but IGF one is a powerful antioxidant. And it completely arrests ROS.

[00:32:15] And so it's a, it's almost like a push pole. You got the growth factors pushing this way and you got the reduction in and potential tumor fighting oxidative stress, pulling this way. And so you see this massive growth that it's it's, it's it's phenomenal. So yeah, I think, I think. A lot of people are taking a buck, buck, buck, minster, fullerene buckyballs rodents live.

[00:32:41] I'm like, dude, man, don't tell me about the rat that lived with the mouse that lived. And they had, they had kill them because the study was over that's you know, Oh my God, I want to take that. I'm going to live forever. There's everything in balance. It's not everything in moderation. It's everything imbalanced.

[00:32:55] The body likes homeostasis. It likes all of the things that are [00:33:00] there. And they're there for a reason and that's millions of years of evolution. Um, I want to take our last commercial break. When we come back, I want to ask you what you hope, uh, both clinicians and lay people take away from this research, but also, uh, what do you see your next study to be?

[00:33:14] So if you can say that, if you could say that. So stay tuned. We'll be right back with more superhuman radio evolution just got kicked dump a notch.

[00:33:28] Welcome back. Talking with dr. Joe Bauer. We're talking about this fascinating gene that was discovered. That is what allows NAD. Plus it produces approaching, correct that it allows NAD plus two to cross the mitochondrial. A membrane and get in there and do its job. So what, what's the future look like now that this has been discovered?

[00:33:52] I know that this is the very beginning and you, and your mind has to be filled with like all the different things that you'd like to learn about this gene. [00:34:00] What does it look like? The future.

[00:34:02] Dr. Joe Bauer, Ph. D.: [00:34:02] Yeah. I mean, I think from a basic research perspective, we just want to get these tools out there and make people aware that this protein exists and that the potential for designing this into experiments exists.

[00:34:10] So now instead of every time that you would give him anything supplements and maybe see some beneficial effect that we can ask whether or not it's happening because of the mitochondrial NAD content, we'd love for this to become a standard tool in the field that you go through. Boosting with normal wild type condition, boosting NAD with blocking mitochondrial input and asking if you still get the beneficial effects, really being able to map out how that's happening.

[00:34:32] Yeah. I mean, from a clinical standpoint, I think you can imagine this now being considered when people have mitochondrial disorders or just if their medical pancreas aren't functioning optimally, right. People have low VO, two max or something like that, or heart failure with preserved ejection fraction, right.

[00:34:46] It's just sort of exercise and tolerance as the phenotype, considering whether or not something's wrong with the system.

[00:34:53] Carl Lanore: [00:34:53] Are you familiar with a peptide protein called Motz C M O T S. [00:35:00] Yes, I use it. I use it. I inject Motzy at, um, five milligrams, three days, three mornings a week. I feel Motzy Motzy if I take Motzy too late at night, I can't sleep.

[00:35:16] And so. Um, is Motzy working, uh, in, in, in the same way, you know, the pathway that NAD plus works or does it affect NAD plus, or,

[00:35:29] Dr. Joe Bauer, Ph. D.: [00:35:29] uh, we haven't seen any direct evidence that it's affecting in AP plus. I mean, the challenge with Nazi is it's encoded in the medical world genome, right. And until recently it hasn't been possible to edit the mitochondrial genome.

[00:35:39] To really do the most basic experiments with Nazi where you would knock it out and see what happens to the surrounding tissue. That's actually changed. Recently. There has been a big discovery of, of a method to edit the mitochondrial genome. Uh, and so I think Montse research is going to be much more interesting than just a couple of years

[00:35:56] Carl Lanore: [00:35:56] fascinating.

[00:35:58] Dr. Joe Bauer, Ph. D.: [00:35:58] But again, we don't know yet whether it's [00:36:00] having any direct link to entity,

[00:36:01] Carl Lanore: [00:36:01] dr. Bauer, do you know anybody in your circle of friends who's injecting Motzy right now?

[00:36:10] Yeah, I know I'm a freak. So years ago I used to call myself the 250 pound Wistar rat because I experimented on myself. We'll see if I'm going to pay for that someday. That will say so what about the whole, um, senescent cell thing? Do you think that you might look into that, like how senescent cells are affecting this, this protein, this pathway and this gene?

[00:36:35] Dr. Joe Bauer, Ph. D.: [00:36:35] Yeah, absolutely. I mean, uh, you know, they, the straightforward experiments just to look at whether it's affecting the, the level of the protein or the level of the MRI and a, um, Are certainly, you know, pretty high up on our list of things to go through as fast as we can to see if there's a lead into one of these areas, it gets a lot more complicated to assess whether just the functions being affected.

[00:36:54] Uh, but certainly that that's something we'll get to, to looking at older animals where we isolate the mitochondria and see if the NAD levels have changed. [00:37:00] And, and if so, if we can attribute it to something specific that's happening to this protein, even if the protein levels, those same

[00:37:06] Carl Lanore: [00:37:06] fascinating stuff, I can't wait to have you back on because I know I'm going to have you back on.

[00:37:09] So when do you think your next paper will be published?

[00:37:15] Dr. Joe Bauer, Ph. D.: [00:37:15] Well, I think, you know, there's sort of two lines of research that follow directly on this and we'll see which one gets gets done. First. One of the things we want to do is not get this gene in vivo. So in an actual animal, see what happens? I think, I mean, I'm pretty sure it's going to be lethal if we knock it out in the whole animal.

[00:37:29] Um, you know, so that'll be a commentary in a paper, but yeah, but I think if we go sell, you know, knocking specific cell types, there may well be interesting adaptive responses. I mean, certainly we'll be able to see. You know what happens acutely when it's, when it's gone for the first few days, but there's possibilities.

[00:37:44] There's things that connects in 43 that have been claimed to share NAD between cells or to at least be able to give anybody a pathway in and out of the cells. So you can imagine it, it may be that the animal actually survives without this pathway. Um, and can, you know, pick up NAD through other pathways that either [00:38:00] emerge or, or get help from the neighboring cells and things like that.

[00:38:02] So we're really interested in that first study to see what happens in a living organism that has a chance to do adapt to this deficiency.

[00:38:09] Carl Lanore: [00:38:09] I think this is fascinating stuff and it's very, very exciting. And I kind of, I feel like this is, this is, this is probably the biggest thing to happen in mitochondrial research in a long time.

[00:38:19] And maybe I'm just a over-optimistic, but I have a feeling that this is really gonna, I can't wait to find out about a supplement, um, or nutritional approach that we see affects this. Uh, it, it, this is big. Um, cause so everybody's taken NAD plus they're buying it. They don't even know if it's working, you know, and they could not, they may not have the Tran uh, the, the, the proper, or the let's say optimal transporter function occurring, and they're just wasting their money on that stuff.

[00:38:48] So,

[00:38:49] Dr. Joe Bauer, Ph. D.: [00:38:49] yeah, I mean, I think entities at that stage where, you know, there's lots of interesting reasons to hypothesize from research and burdens that it's going to be good, but you haven't proven it yet in humans. And it's a high powered to prove it in [00:39:00] humans. So then there's this element of faith at this point, you know, you either wait 10 years and see what happened for real or you just,

[00:39:08] Carl Lanore: [00:39:08] right, right.

[00:39:09] Listen, I want to thank you for being on the show today.

[00:39:12] Dr. Joe Bauer, Ph. D.: [00:39:12] Thanks for having me.

[00:39:13] Carl Lanore: [00:39:13] Thanks. Take care. Take care. Hi, we're gonna, we're gonna switch up things in just a moment. I want to give you the update on, I know a lot of you had been fired, so I I've I've I have an addictive personality. Everybody knows that.

[00:39:27] Um, I'm a product of the sixties. And so I have abused caffeine for, for really, quite a long time. And many of, you know, I've come in and said, Oh, I'm, I've stopped caffeine. And then a week later I'm using 1500 milligrams a day. Well, I can tell you not even chocolate. I, my last, I had no caffeine, Tuesday on the blueprint power hour, and people saw, I looked like I was a junkie Jones.

[00:39:52] I would bite my fingernails on the air. I was rubbing my forehead. All I could think about was, man, I wish I had a bang energy drink right now to throw [00:40:00] by two Wednesday. Uh, it got worse. But I didn't use any caffeine, not even chocolate, nothing with caffeine and nicotine, nothing training was ridiculously hard.

[00:40:12] I was, I dragged myself into the gym. I trained, I dragged myself out of the gym. I came here. I did the shows around Thursday. I started noticing I wasn't looking for caffeine. First thing in the morning at all. And I was going to the gym first thing in the morning. So I could just get in there and have no excuses.

[00:40:31] Um, this weekend I trained hard. I had one of my best leg days I've had in probably the past couple of years today, I trashed my legs and, uh, I gotta tell you, I there's so many things. First of all, my gut has been F up for so long. It's gotten distended. All I do is belt. I wake up in the morning, belching.

[00:40:54] I even, I haven't eaten anything since six, 6:00 PM the night before. I'm not, I'm [00:41:00] not bloated at all anymore. I said, this morning, your stomach looks like it got flatter. It's the caffeine I'm telling you. We, our population is killing themselves with caffeine. Now, caffeine and coffee are two separate things.

[00:41:13] So people like to say, Oh, but coffee's okay. Coffee's actually worse. Okay. Caffeine raises homocysteine levels all by itself, which is an independent marker for heart disease. Think about that for a second coffee raises it even more. You know why? Because coffee also blocks the receptors in the liver that get the caffeine out of your body.

[00:41:34] So coffee turns everybody into a slow metabolizer of caffeine. I am so excited right now and you know what, I, I actually think I've developed an allergic reaction to caffeine because when I drank it, my throat stops the itch. I get a tickle in my throat, my nose it's stuffed up. So today is the first full week.

[00:41:54] Last Tuesday, no caffeine today. No caffeine. And I really feel like I need, [00:42:00] I should get a medal because I have been abusing caffeine for the better part of 18 years. Now I'm talking about at least a thousand milligrams a day. I used to, I used to do 300 milligrams, first thing in the morning. Go into the gym and train legs do 300 milligrams right after that so that I could come do whatever I had to do after that, because I was exhausted and trash.

[00:42:22] See, and that's the other thing. Adele Moosa did a great blog post about four years ago. And he showed that caffeine pushes you into being over-trained whether you want to be or not. That's that that's those of us who understand how overtraining rots your body. Think about that. And the other thing that I want to say is everybody always talks about.

[00:42:43] Stress stress kills, stress kills stress skills. Well, you know, when you can't get on it, treadmill and run for them to do a heart test on you, they give you an injection of basically the same types of things that, [00:43:00] that caffeine does. They give you an injection of stimulants that, that raise your heart rate and raise all the stress adrenal hormones in your body.

[00:43:09] Caffeine is. Is liquid stress. You're drinking stress. That's what you're doing with caffeine. And the fact that you realize that and get it out of your life. I promise you, your body will thank you for it. It's garbage. And I know everybody loves it. Everybody uses it. I, I was as close to it being a junkie, as you could be with caffeine.

[00:43:29] Really, really. So. Think about that. But today today's my first full week. No caffeine. I feel great. My mind is, is, is right again. I'm sh I slept good last night. I, I trained, I trained hard today. No caffeine. So think about it. If you have gut give up the coffee, give up the caffeine, just do it for three weeks.

[00:43:50] What do you got to lose? And if it doesn't do anything to your gut, but I feel so much better. I can't tell you. And everybody complains about having gut problems. We're going to take a break. [00:44:00] And when we come back, we're gonna be joined by Jason Provenzano. And we're going to talk about CBD and sports nutrition.

[00:44:06] What can it bring to the table? Stay tuned. We'll be right back

[00:44:13] whose oxygen for the power of

[00:44:20] Welcome back to the super gamma radio we're joined by Jason Provenzano from planet earth CBD. How you doing Jason? I'm doing good.

[00:44:30] Jason Provenzano: [00:44:30] How you been called?

[00:44:31] Carl Lanore: [00:44:31] Wonderful. So you're right. We were messaging offline, Jason. Who put me in touch with the guy I worked for when I was probably 16, 17 years old, uh, Pat Reynolds, they called him the Fox back then.

[00:44:44] I know the story, why they call him the Fox. And you, when you said to me the silver Fox, and then when I saw his picture, I was like, Oh my God, he got older, but so did I, we do it. You're lucky, Jason. And you, you, you, you're not great at all, but yeah, I'm hoping to talk to him soon. Cause I have very fond memories of [00:45:00] him.

[00:45:00] I was thinking. Did maybe he and I end on a bad note because I messaged them on Facebook and I thought, well, you know, I was a kid back then and you know, but I don't think so. I think that

[00:45:13] Jason Provenzano: [00:45:13] I spoke to him and he said nothing but good things. And he's he remembered who you are. And yeah. Now it's all good.

[00:45:21] I'll be busy between here and there.

[00:45:24] Carl Lanore: [00:45:24] Yeah. Yeah. Anyway, how are you doing Jason? What's new with you. How's everything.

[00:45:29] Jason Provenzano: [00:45:29] Everything's fantastic. You know, living the dream.

[00:45:31] Carl Lanore: [00:45:31] Yeah, there you go. So we're here today to talk about CBD, uh, as an ergogenic, as a dietary solution during training. And I don't think anybody knows more about this than you, because you've actually formulated products that work synergistically with CBD CBD for, for people to use around their workouts.

[00:45:53] Right. Yes.

[00:45:55] Jason Provenzano: [00:45:55] Um, you know,

[00:45:58] Carl Lanore: [00:45:58] like

[00:45:58] Jason Provenzano: [00:45:58] the, the, [00:46:00] the misinformation about a lot of CBD that's out there, you know, it's, you just don't know what you get. And when, and with planet earth CBD, you know, our CB is sustainably sourced right here in the U S you know, with other brands, you have no idea what you're getting and you know, and there's a lot of misinformation out there now with planet earth, you're guaranteed that the CBD.

[00:46:24] Is sourced in Oregon. It's never sprayed, um,

[00:46:32] developed into sports, nutrition products, you know, especially, you know, to help, uh, with the focus and the concentration and the recovery of your workout. You know, there's a lot of great sports products that are out there, but, um, Not many, you know, uh, implemented CBD of high quality, you know, to go along with it.

[00:46:55] So now it's like it's enhanced

[00:46:59] Carl Lanore: [00:46:59] sports [00:47:00] products. Well, I know, I know a lot of people who would take their favorite sports supplement and take it with CBD. So this was the natural. Next step to just start making the products with the CBD in it. So explain to me and the audience, what does CBD do for me?

[00:47:21] Look, I'm a 60 year old guy, 62 years old. I wish I was 60. Um, and, and I, I still train very hard and I live with pain and the pain. Bothers me sometimes when I'm training, I'm not training as hard as I'd like to because I'm nursing. This is the CBD going to help a guy like me

[00:47:39] Jason Provenzano: [00:47:39] CBD will definitely, uh, it will definitely help somebody like you.

[00:47:44] I mean, if we're looking at how you were talking about not having your caffeine. Okay. And, and, and you're getting rid of your caffeine, let's talk about, you want to get into the gym, but you're kind of just dragging your ass

[00:47:57] Carl Lanore: [00:47:57] now.

[00:47:58] Jason Provenzano: [00:47:58] And you, you,

[00:48:00] [00:47:59] Carl Lanore: [00:47:59] you take a scoop of the

[00:48:00] Jason Provenzano: [00:48:00] pre-workout, the blue ice. We call it the blue ice.

[00:48:03] Cause it's very refreshing it. Say it's almost along the lines of like a blue raspberry. Um, but it relaxes your mind. It gets you pumped. It gives you energy. Um, it's got 30 milligrams, a full spectrum, nano emulsified, hemp extract per serving. Okay. It improves the performance. It reduces fatigue. It enhances your focus.

[00:48:26] I mean, what else do you need to stop training?

[00:48:28] Carl Lanore: [00:48:28] No. Yeah. So, so, so I think a lot of people have confused. A lot of people think that CBD makes you, I'm going to say a word that you probably know cause you're Italian moonshot, you know, it makes you, it makes you weary. It makes you sluggish that why would I take that and then train?

[00:48:43] So you're saying it doesn't do that right.

[00:48:46] Jason Provenzano: [00:48:46] No, it absolutely relaxes you or, or it allows you to focus. It doesn't, uh, it relieves stress and stuff, but when you

[00:48:58] Carl Lanore: [00:48:58] put it with

[00:49:00] [00:49:00] Jason Provenzano: [00:49:00] a pre-workout, which is loaded with B vitamins, you know, to give you the energy levels, it's just going to allow you to hone in on what you gotta do and go from there.

[00:49:10] No, it's never going to leave you slumped

[00:49:12] Carl Lanore: [00:49:12] over. So, what you're saying is what it sounds like to me is it gives you that calm a feeling like, uh, like, you know, the way you should be right before an important event instead of being jittery and stressed

[00:49:26] Jason Provenzano: [00:49:26] out. I, you know, I can't speak on most people, but my brain is very difficult to turn off.

[00:49:32] You know, how use that,

[00:49:34] Carl Lanore: [00:49:34] uh,

[00:49:35] Jason Provenzano: [00:49:35] you got an addictive personality, you know, that's, that's me also. And, uh, my mind never stops going, you know, I keep a pad and a pen right next to my nightstand because if I wake up and something's in my head, if I don't jot it down on the paper, I can't fall back to

[00:49:53] Carl Lanore: [00:49:53] sleep.

[00:49:55] Jason Provenzano: [00:49:55] Yeah.

[00:49:55] Well, I have something for that too, which is a soft gel that has [00:50:00] mellow tone the common wheel, but that's a whole different subject.

[00:50:03] Carl Lanore: [00:50:03] Right, right. Which

[00:50:04] Jason Provenzano: [00:50:04] allows me to get my straight eight, you know, instead of five and a half or my six,

[00:50:09] Carl Lanore: [00:50:09] but.

[00:50:10] Jason Provenzano: [00:50:10] Um, you know, this, it just

[00:50:13] Carl Lanore: [00:50:13] allows you to

[00:50:15] Jason Provenzano: [00:50:15] relax and be the best person you're supposed to be, you know, because, uh, the anxiety, you know, it's, it's the number one killers with stress, you know?

[00:50:26] Um, this just gives you an even keel, that's it?

[00:50:30] Carl Lanore: [00:50:30] It does. It does. It does the blue ice CBD component hit you faster because it's a nano emulsified.

[00:50:38] Jason Provenzano: [00:50:38] Oh, yes. It definitely works in Tia stream a lot quicker than that, because what happens with the nano emulsified that most people don't understand is

[00:50:47] Carl Lanore: [00:50:47] it's the particle size

[00:50:49] Jason Provenzano: [00:50:49] of the CBD is it's okay.

[00:50:51] It's put through an emulsifier that breaks up the particle size to like, you know, whatever, whatever that percentage is. But if it [00:51:00] was a whole particle, it'll break it up to a thousands of a particle, which the absorption rate gets in there a lot quicker.

[00:51:06] Carl Lanore: [00:51:06] Okay. So, so how, if I'm going to train at 12 o'clock in the afternoon, when do I take the blue ice?

[00:51:14] Oh, I

[00:51:14] Jason Provenzano: [00:51:14] would say before you get in the car to drive on over, you know, to the gym and even why you're, why you're trained in it, you know,

[00:51:23] Carl Lanore: [00:51:23] you put it in,

[00:51:24] Jason Provenzano: [00:51:24] put it in the shake or stop drinking it on your way over there and, you know, and even use it, uh, you know, quench your thirst while

[00:51:31] Carl Lanore: [00:51:31] you're in there. Is there any sugar in the, in the pre-workout?

[00:51:35] No. Then what's the other product. There's another, there's three products that you have specifically

[00:51:41] Jason Provenzano: [00:51:41] or beds. There's a protein, which is, you know, it's strictly just it's protein, a vanilla protein. It's got 22 grams of protein. Again, dosed with 30 milligrams of the full spectrum, nano emulsified, um, again, reaching your bloodstream faster.

[00:52:00] [00:51:59] Uh, You know, it's loaded with a wide range of essential amino acids in there, which is going to help you gain muscle and build strength. You know, um, there are three things it's just supposed to be taken when you working out, you know, uh, one would be a protein, you know, to, to help build, get your aminos in that the other would be

[00:52:19] Carl Lanore: [00:52:19] the

[00:52:19] Jason Provenzano: [00:52:19] pre-workout, which is going to get you.

[00:52:22] Uh, wanting to go to the gym, you know, give you the energy. And then the next one, and this is the most important one is the post-workout,

[00:52:30] Carl Lanore: [00:52:30] which is going to help with the recovery.

[00:52:31] Jason Provenzano: [00:52:31] And we have it flavored in a great it's, a coconut lime Mohito flavor. Um, You know, many workouts, they're going to leave you in pain, you know, but, uh, that's because the exercise causes microscopic damage to the muscle fibers, triggering the body, respond and repair.

[00:52:49] It leaves you feeling stiff and sore.

[00:52:51] Carl Lanore: [00:52:51] The post-work,

[00:52:52] Jason Provenzano: [00:52:52] how it is going to relax the muscle. It's good as, uh, reduce the spasms. [00:53:00] And it's, you know, the CBD promotes the movement, you know, and, and, and, and, and gets rid of the stiffness that,

[00:53:06] Carl Lanore: [00:53:06] you know, you could get. What else is it? What else is in the post-workout besides CBD?

[00:53:11] Is there protein in that as well? Well, no electrolytes. Oh yeah. Minerals. So you

[00:53:18] Jason Provenzano: [00:53:18] look at the sideline at, at a Gatorade, you know, or, you know, one of those things, you know, it's a huge light thing. You know, people are drinking to reduce the cramps and stuff. Yeah. Flight, but you

[00:53:31] Carl Lanore: [00:53:31] know,

[00:53:31] Jason Provenzano: [00:53:31] those things, you know, they're, they're loaded for taste.

[00:53:35] They're loaded, you know, you know, the wrong way. This is designed specifically for you to go in. Do what you gotta do drink this after it's going to

[00:53:44] Carl Lanore: [00:53:44] help you recover. It's going to help you recover

[00:53:47] Jason Provenzano: [00:53:47] faster. It's going to help the muscles recover faster. It, you know, it's going to get rid of the soreness because again, CBD helps with pain.

[00:53:55] We talked about that last time, you know,

[00:53:58] Carl Lanore: [00:53:58] um,

[00:53:59] Jason Provenzano: [00:53:59] it, it [00:54:00] just, it made all the sense in the world to, you know, when I was going to do

[00:54:03] Carl Lanore: [00:54:03] this was to

[00:54:05] Jason Provenzano: [00:54:05] just. Focus on forth nutrition with it. I didn't want to be, let me have tinctures in a bottle and do something gummy bears. That's not what this was for. This was designed

[00:54:18] Dr. Joe Bauer, Ph. D.: [00:54:18] the

[00:54:18] Jason Provenzano: [00:54:18] whole thing, the entire line.

[00:54:19] And if you go onto the, the website, climate arts cbd.com

[00:54:25] Carl Lanore: [00:54:25] and you watch

[00:54:26] Jason Provenzano: [00:54:26] there's the video and that whole video is showing this sport, this athlete, this person, you know, Doing everything. And, and, and it's, what was, it was designed for cough.

[00:54:40] Carl Lanore: [00:54:40] So we have a special offer for people. If, uh, if you go to the URL SHR network.biz forward slash power and use the code power, you'll get this the 20% off the best CBD infused pre post workout [00:55:00] and protein powder.

[00:55:02] And I want to, I want to clarify something, the protein powder, the proteins not derived from CBD, you're using dairy protein, right? Oh yeah, yeah, yeah. So you're using, you're using the best way protein and adding. I don't want to, I don't want people to think that this is a, you know, a plant based protein, which is very ineffective.

[00:55:22] You're just adding the nano most refined CBD to a high quality protein. Correct. That's beautiful. That's beautiful. Correct. So, yeah, I mean, that's a great idea. Now, do you have anybody in the office that works out Jason? Do you, Oh, I have the people

[00:55:39] Jason Provenzano: [00:55:39] that work out here. Matter of fact, in the warehouse, we have a gym positioned off to the side.

[00:55:44] If somebody like, if work working too late and they don't, we have, you know, a shower, uh, that they could use and they also have them in the warehouse.

[00:55:52] Carl Lanore: [00:55:52] So are any of the guys at work using these products and training? Do they [00:56:00] report, what are they reporting back?

[00:56:02] Jason Provenzano: [00:56:02] Oh, they love it. They love it, you know, and, and, and they feel good about it because they know where it's made.

[00:56:07] They know how it's made. They know that, you know, it's, you know, and, and an FDA approved facility, GMP compliant. Right. Um, yeah. All of my stuff was third party tested. You know, that, that's the good thing. Like when you go to the site, a lot of places claim this, do this, but they don't show you the results.

[00:56:26] You know, we have the results posted that you see the lot that you're buying, it's it. And that lot has been tested and that's, what's the latest that's up.

[00:56:34] Carl Lanore: [00:56:34] Right, right. Very, very cool. All right. So I'm going to give this URL again. The URL is SHR network.biz/power. And that's capital P O w E R. If you use the code power, you'll get 20% off all of the planet, earth CBD SportsLine sports, nutrition line.

[00:56:59] Give it a [00:57:00] try. I want to hear reports back from the audience. I want your people to tell me what you think I'm actually going to try the pre-workout. Because I'm changing up my whole pre-workout now that I've cut caffeine out. And, uh, and I'm going to report back to, I have a feeling it's going to help me because like I said, I got lots of injuries from training for a couple of decades.

[00:57:19] And, um, they, they slow me down in the gym, you know, I got to turn my knee a certain way, so that doesn't hurt. And, you know, so maybe I can get rid of those pains and it'll actually make my workouts even more productive. Absolutely. So, um, Jason, thanks for being here today to tell the audience and thanks for the wonderful offer as well.

[00:57:40] You got a call. Thank you

[00:57:41] Jason Provenzano: [00:57:41] for having me.

[00:57:42] Carl Lanore: [00:57:42] And if you talk to Pat. Tell him. I want to talk to him. I will say the kid. I still think of myself as a kid. When I think of him say the kid wants to talk to you. I don't,

[00:57:53] Jason Provenzano: [00:57:53] I don't know how social media friendly he is. So I don't know if he's even looked at your friend that I'm on [00:58:00] Facebook, but I'll make sure he knows

[00:58:01] Carl Lanore: [00:58:01] that.

[00:58:01] Thank you. Thank you. Thank you, Jason. All right. Thank you very much. And again, SHR network.biz forward slash. Capital P O w E R. Use the code capital P O w E R. Save 20% off all of the planet earth CBD sports performance CBD, infused products. Check it out. Okay, Jason, we'll talk later. Thanks. And that's it for today's show.

[00:58:27] I am. I'm excited that I'm caffeine free. I can't tell you. How excited I am to be caffeine free. I feel so frigging good. I don't, I, I don't know what to say about it, and I wish I would have done this a long time ago. I really do. I look, we have lots of great shows planned all week. We're still not on Facebook, but we will be back on Facebook shortly.

[00:58:49] Uh, I want to thank everybody for watching and listening and participating and, uh, we'll see you tomorrow. [00:59:00]